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    Activists want chimp declared a 'person'

    Originally posted by By WILLIAM J. KOLE, Associated Press Writer

    Activists want chimp declared a 'person'

    VIENNA, Austria - In some ways, Hiasl is like any other Viennese: He indulges a weakness for pastry, likes to paint and enjoys chilling out watching TV. But he doesn't care for coffee, and he isn't actually a person — at least not yet.

    In a case that could set a global legal precedent for granting basic rights to apes, animal rights advocates are seeking to get the 26-year-old male chimpanzee legally declared a "person."
    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070504/...himp_challenge

    So what if he flings his own shit at his keepers. He likes tv and pastries!

    #2
    Originally posted by Buck_Nastier
    So what if he flings his own shit at his keepers. He likes tv and pastries!
    LMAO! That's a great one, M!

    Comment


      #3
      I knew the moment Bush raised his hand and took the oath of the President this would happen.

      If the chimp is over 90% human in it's genes does that mean we are over 90% chimp?

      It's a shame we consider other species as legally THINGS. And have to go to this extent to give another living THING protection against US.

      I actually think liberals evolved from the bonobo and conservatives from the chimp. Or vice versa.
      Life isn't about getting thru the storm but learning to dance in the rain.

      Comment


        #4
        Very human like.

        Comment


          #5
          Airplane ride! Sweet!

          Comment


            #6
            I think that if I had hidden the names of the animal from which the brain came, most people would have a hard time saying which was which.




            Wise.

            Comment


              #7
              Your right Dr. Wise. I would have guessed your brain and my brain. NO I am not going to say which is which.
              Life isn't about getting thru the storm but learning to dance in the rain.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Wise Young
                I think that if I had hidden the names of the animal from which the brain came, most people would have a hard time saying which was which.




                Wise.
                sir,i wont comment your response.....but i have a question please....why the human brain helps us to evolve diffr,than any other creature on earth?[airplanes ,submarines ,satelites etc.?]

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by adi chicago
                  sir,i wont comment your response.....but i have a question please....why the human brain helps us to evolve diffr,than any other creature on earth?[airplanes ,submarines ,satelites etc.?]
                  In my opinion, our achievementa in these areas result mostly from the parts of the brain responsible for communication. Many of the achievements that you referred to, such as airplanes, submarines, satellites, etc., could not have been done without oral and oral communication at a complexity level that far surpasses the communication between members of other species. None of these could have been achieved without cooperation and coordination of thousands of people.

                  I guess that one can equally attribute it to mathematical, logical, or symbolic thinking. Let us put that hypothesis to a test.

                  • Would it be possible to build an airplane, submarine, or satellite without mathematics? It would be difficult but one can express many concepts without mathematical symbols. For instance, evolution occurred without mathematics. If we did not have mathematics, perhaps we would have simply bred huge birds that could carry passengers, or fish that had big pockets with breathing tubes to be our submarine, or created a network of plants that can transmit electrical or sound impulses to many parts of the world. Before we had satellites or cell phones, people communicated through line-of-sight fires and drums. The latter might not be as fast as a satellite and would be quite cryptic but potentially could be pretty effective.

                  • Could we do it without logic? Logical thinking implies the proposition of hypotheses (the if) and the logical conclusion (then) that follows from the hypotheses. After some thought, I think that we can do it without logic. After all, I know many people who think perfectly well and come to the right conclusions but do so in a seemingly illogical fashion.

                  • Could we do it without symbolic thinking? I don't know. Symbolic thinking is of course using symbols to represent complex concepts. It is a way of explaining, of organizing one's thoughts, and expressing what has been done to others. Thus, when I say quagmire, it is a symbol of many things, evoking images of Vietnam. Likewise, when I say X^2, it means to multiple a quantity by itself. I suppose that we can have these concepts without the symbols. However, without symbols, we cannot have written communication. Without such communication, a way of keeping a record of our thoughts, we cannot communicate, document, and pass on previous thoughts and achievements to others. So, in my opinion, symbolic thinking is necessary.

                  Wise.
                  Last edited by Wise Young; 26 May 2007, 12:20 AM.

                  Comment


                    #10


                    At first glance, this picture seems to be about a whale tossing a baby whale in the air but a closer look reveals that it is a dolphin or porpoise that is being tossed. Note the bottlenose and the dorsal fin. This photo won the First Place in the National WildLife Awards:
                    First Place - Mammals - Professional, National Wildlife Awards

                    HUMPBACK WHALE AND DOLPHIN

                    Kauai, Hawaii, USA

                    Lori Mazzuca

                    Kailua Kona, hawaii, USA

                    “I was observing a strange interaction between a pair of bottlenose dolphins and a humpback whale, when it became apparent that the two species were collaborating in some way. The dolphin was lying on a humpback whale’s head while it was slowly swimming along. Looking through my camera lens the stunt appeared to be orchestrated by mutual “agreement.” The whale very slowly—and vertically—lifted the dolphin into the air. I expected the dolphin to wriggle atop the humpback’s head to get off, but it just laid still and arched, trying to stay on top of the whale’s snout. In this frame the dolphin was beginning its slippery return to the sea. Once back in the ocean, the dolphin swiftly swam away with the other dolphin, leaping joyfully as if they had just scored a coup!”

                    Canon EOS 10D; 70-200mm lens with 1.4x extender; digital capture.

                    [ TOP
                    Wise.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      That's awesome! ^^^

                      Comment


                        #12
                        That photo deserves the award for sure.
                        Although one would have to be very uninterested in marine life to not realize on first glance that dolphin wasn't a baby humpback whale.

                        Wonder what those dolphins really were doing?
                        They are so inventive and playful. Maybe it was like an amusement park ride to them. Would be to me too.

                        What a great ride that would be. Definately an "E" ticket.
                        Life isn't about getting thru the storm but learning to dance in the rain.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Wise Young
                          In my opinion, our achievementa in these areas result mostly from the parts of the brain responsible for communication. Many of the achievements that you referred to, such as airplanes, submarines, satellites, etc., could not have been done without oral and oral communication at a complexity level that far surpasses the communication between members of other species. None of these could have been achieved without cooperation and coordination of thousands of people.

                          I guess that one can equally attribute it to mathematical, logical, or symbolic thinking. Let us put that hypothesis to a test.

                          • Would it be possible to build an airplane, submarine, or satellite without mathematics? It would be difficult but one can express many concepts without mathematical symbols. For instance, evolution occurred without mathematics. If we did not have mathematics, perhaps we would have simply bred huge birds that could carry passengers, or fish that had big pockets with breathing tubes to be our submarine, or created a network of plants that can transmit electrical or sound impulses to many parts of the world. Before we had satellites or cell phones, people communicated through line-of-sight fires and drums. The latter might not be as fast as a satellite and would be quite cryptic but potentially could be pretty effective.

                          • Could we do it without logic? Logical thinking implies the proposition of hypotheses (the if) and the logical conclusion (then) that follows from the hypotheses. After some thought, I think that we can do it without logic. After all, I know many people who think perfectly well and come to the right conclusions but do so in a seemingly illogical fashion.

                          • Could we do it without symbolic thinking? I don't know. Symbolic thinking is of course using symbols to represent complex concepts. It is a way of explaining, of organizing one's thoughts, and expressing what has been done to others. Thus, when I say quagmire, it is a symbol of many things, evoking images of Vietnam. Likewise, when I say X^2, it means to multiple a quantity by itself. I suppose that we can have these concepts without the symbols. However, without symbols, we cannot have written communication. Without such communication, a way of keeping a record of our thoughts, we cannot communicate, document, and pass on previous thoughts and achievements to others. So, in my opinion, symbolic thinking is necessary.

                          Wise.

                          Would humans have even imagined or thought of flight had they not seen birds and insects flying?
                          Or thought of going deep into the depths of the oceans without seeing creatures that did just that?

                          Would we have thought of sonar without witnessing it?

                          Electricity without lightening? I don't know.
                          It seems the further we try to take ourselves away from nature the closer we realize we actually are.

                          DNA mapping is man's doing..but just look what it is showing us.

                          Communication? Ants, bees, wasps, etc. They don't say a word but to watch their actions due to some sort of communication is just breathtaking. Geese and all migratory species..no maps..no talking navigation systems..just remembering what your elders showed you.

                          Elephant herds..amazing. And how they communicate is just so advanced even to our educated versions of communication.

                          Even this photo. That dolphin KNEW the humpback was friendly and posed no real danger to him/her. Somehow that had to be communicated. Or animals are smarter than humans.
                          Last edited by Lindox; 4 Jun 2007, 6:16 PM.
                          Life isn't about getting thru the storm but learning to dance in the rain.

                          Comment

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