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    #16
    Originally posted by stlyin moe
    let's see, I'm shooting, hunting, riding ATV's, trying to put a deal together to race an offroad car and chasing wild women...lol That's all I have time for now
    And you are scared of going in the water!
    C5 injury with partial C6 function on left.

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      #17
      Not really scared, more enlightened about how quickly and easily things go wrong down there. I have hundreds of dives under my belt so I know from experience. Years ago millions of people used to drive without seatbelts. Today you can see why it's important to wear one. Ya you can drive around without one, but if you do it's generally accepted that you're doing so foolishly. Diving is a sport where able bodied people drown every year. Someone without the use of their diaphram and other extremities is really laying it on the line no matter how cautious they think they're being.

      Let's forget about the aforementioned risks I've already noted and look at the normal problems someone with SCI has to deal with...

      1. no ability to regulate body heat: Diving anywhere in California puts you in cold water. A para has some ability to generate heat via arm movement, but what about their lower extremities? A quad has even less ability to get heat going. One can go from hypothermic to septic in the blink of an eye. I haven't heard if there's any info on what the effects of septic clotting and elevated nitrogen levels are on people with SCI and I don't want to find out.

      2. drastically compromised ability to cough: Your mask could become knocked off or bumped asckew causing some flooding of the mask and just enough that you have to cough, but because you don't have the ability to cough with enough force to clear your lungs, you're in serious trouble.

      3. Having an autonomic reaction from an oncoming UTI: You are on the boat and feeling kind of like you're in a funk, but you think it's from the motion of the boat you're not used to. You get suited up and drop in the water, descend to 30 feet and the effects of the autonomic reaction really kick in. You're in serious trouble.

      4. The effects of pressure at depth could cause a BM: Imagine being in 30 feet of water and having an accident. I once got sea sick while in 40 feet of water. It was calm when I entered the water, but a surge came in 30 minutes into my dive. I got sick in one minute. I couldn't get to the surface fast enough before puking through my regulator. I was swarmed with toothy fish eating the vomit that exhausted through my regulator. I would imagine it could get pretty nasty crapping your wetsuit and being covered neck to toes in your own filth. Then god forbid it should leak out (especially if you weren't wearing a wetsuit), you'd create a chum slick that would have fish swarming you and hopefully none of them were Cudas or other large toothy swimmers.

      Any of the normal problems we with SCI face are monumentally magnified in a diving situation. Any magnification of common SCI issues is extremely dangerous to fatal.

      Lewis, I've never had a "close call" shooting or hunting or riding an ATV or racing a fully caged race car. Granted my motocross bike put me in this chair and damn near in my grave, however, I'm not doing that anymore either.

      Like I said, I highly recommend against it, but if you're going to do it really weigh the consequences, be absolutely certain everything is good with you that day, know your own limits and don't let anyone talk you into something that could be your grave and remember no-one on that boat or beach has any kind of control over the ocean or it's critters.
      "Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty." ~ Thomas Jefferson

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        #18
        Originally posted by stlyin moe
        Lewis, I've never had a "close call" shooting or hunting or riding an ATV or racing a fully caged race car. Granted my motocross bike put me in this chair and damn near in my grave, however, I'm not doing that anymore either.
        So, you're scared. Nothing wrong with that, but why are you trying to scare others?

        The irony in your post is killing me. Your concerns about diving are valid, but there are comparable risks in everything that you've mentioned: driving, ATV riding, car racing, and hunting.

        If you're looking for agreement to justify your decision, you're not going to get it from me. Get out there and dive!
        C5 injury with partial C6 function on left.

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          #19
          I will be going for my first diving experience this Dec. in St. Thomas. I can't wait. I have been wanting to do this for ever and finally, just said next vacation. Arrangements are already made.
          Sometimes the lights all shinin on me; Other times I can barely see. Lately it occurs to me what a long, strange trip its been: The Grateful Dead

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            #20
            No I wouldn't say scared is the right word for it. Scared is fear and fear is an instinctual survival mechanism that protects us from something we "don't know" or understand. Take a snake as an example. If you're unfamiliar with snakes instinctively you'll be afraid because you won't know what to expect or if they're poisonous.

            As explained prior I know what can happen from experience. I also know from experience that many, many instructors DO NOT talk about these issues and as we in this unique community know these issues are real and can raise their ugly head at the most inopportune time.

            I'm not trying to scare anyone either. I think it's extremely important for anyone with SCI that's considering taking up diving to be thinking about these issues long before they hit salt water so they can weigh the risk and reward and have a plan in mind way ahead of time about how they're going to react to these issues.

            I watched as a dive instructor put a gal's mask on with the snorkel inside the mask strap instead of outside. Here mask leaked constantly. This was a pool dive/lesson and no scuba had been introduced yet. She was able bodied and literally choking as the water filled in her mask. She was having a miserable time and eventually gave up on the lessons. This instructor was completely unaware that he'd put her mask on in that manner and just let her flounder and choke through an experience that should have been a cake walk.

            I'm also not looking for support here in this thread. I am trying to convey my experiences to those that are diving now and those that wish to in the future.

            I disagree with your comment Lewis..."but there are comparable risks in everything that you've mentioned: driving, ATV riding, car racing, and hunting."

            None of the aforementioned have the same amount of risk. If someone knocks my hat off I'm not going to suffocate as you will if someone knocks your mask off. If I have to cough during any of these activities I can do so without crushing pressure preventing my lungs from expanding enough to gather sufficient air to cough the obstruction out. If I become ill from a UTI I don't have to worry about excessive nitrogen levels in my blood and if I become septic I'm not in the cold california water as I struggle to maintain body heat and heart rate.

            There are risks associated with those activities but none near as risky as scuba diving with all the issues commonly associated with SCI.

            Don't be lulled into a false sense of security thinking that because you don't hear about people drowning while scuba diving on the news at night that it doesn't happen. It does. Skydivers jump out of planes and splat on the ground and they don't make the news either. You'd think these would be newsworthy stories yet they go unreported.

            Go ahead, enjoy. I'll be here to read all about it if you make it back...lol

            Be careful out there...
            "Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty." ~ Thomas Jefferson

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by stlyin moe
              I disagree with your comment Lewis..."but there are comparable risks in everything that you've mentioned: driving, ATV riding, car racing, and hunting."
              I'm afraid we will have to agree to disagree here. Our perceptions of risk and danger differ, so we will both find holes in our arguments/examples.

              Most people are more risk averse to things they are unfamiliar. This is not the case for you, as you have demonstrated your knowledge and experience in diving. So why are you still on the dock?

              Your knowledge of what could happen mitigates the likelihood of something ill happening.

              I double dare you!
              C5 injury with partial C6 function on left.

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                #22
                agreed, we'll agree to disagree...
                "Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty." ~ Thomas Jefferson

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                  #23
                  Moe, I haven't done scuba...yet. But I have spent a good deal of time in a race car. Have you thought about how your body will deal with being inverted in the car and hanging from the belts? This is a very common occurence in racing, and is no prob for AB... but.
                  Hunting is probably one of the safest things we do, statisticaly it's safer than ping pong.
                  Thanks for the heads up on scuba riscks. I'm thinking of learning for freshwater dives mostly.

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