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  • Do we deserve money from the government?

    I've wondered quite a bit about this. For a time I received a check every month for about $600. I took it, but my attitude was that if I got a letter one day that said "no more dough, too bad so sad" I would have no right to be upset.

    I've thought about this with regard specifically to high quads too. Do you ever feel like nobody is under any obligation to care for you? Or do you feel like you are entitled to all the care you get?
    "When you come to a fork in the road, take it." -Yogi Berra

  • #2
    I see it like this. They'll pay people who are gainfully unemployed, revel in their unemployed status and flaunt around like jackass's....so they can pay me too. Im not independantly wealthy, nor do I make squillions of dollars per annum

    What about the elderly? Gotta give them something, they dont have an active income

    I had troubles getting a disability payment because I "wasn't disabled enough" which I found amusing because the town drunk down the street was on the same payment because "she couldnt help it"....no one forces her to drink excessively

    On a side note...I'd enjoy seeing a government letter that says 'too bad so sad' capped with a 'lol' at the end

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    • #3
      quote:
      [I had troubles getting a disability payment because I "wasn't disabled enough" which I found amusing because the town drunk down the street was on the same payment because "she couldnt help it"....no one forces her to drink excessively].

      I know what you mean it really pisses me off big time especially here in the UK, alot of people have never worked in their lives and are on all sorts of money and also loads of imagrants (sp) get houses which are paid for and money every week. It does my head in coz people who really need it cant.
      I like the dreams of the future better than the history of the past, so one way to get the most out of life is to look at it as an adventure.

      Comment


      • #4
        Janus I would rather my money goes to someone who is genuinely disabled then what Gendo said - those who could be considered 'normal' and flaunt it and there are lots of them. David gets so upset when he meets someone with 'more than me' physically who is on assistance. My very own niece who just went through a bipolar diagnosis - I have come to terms with the fact that she may be on assistance the rest of her life and she is only 22yrs old. I'm glad those programs are there for her. Is that my tax money well spent? Definately! Her parents: my sister and her husband, have been both working since they were 14yrs old! By golly their tax dollars outta help their own daughter!

        I think of it this way: It's not your fault that medicine hasn't come up with something better to make you better. 'The people' will pay for that until 'the people' decide that's a priority.

        Don't forget about your family; parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles, siblings, cousins, friends, people who know you and all work/have worked ... who pay/paid for their taxes. Would they want it to help you? Of course they would! Don't feel the least bit bad. Do you not pay taxes when you buy something, anything every day? In Canada we pay PST/GST which adds up to 15% in Ontario alone. I gross something just under $1000/wk but take home something between $600-$700 per week. The rest is income taxes, employment insurance, Canada Pension plan, union dues and pension. Then I'm taxed when I buy David's coffee and my tea on the way home from work!

        Nope, I hope those programs are there if I ever feel I should need it. Michael Moore's film Sicko kind of touches on this ... how Canadians feel about paying high taxes and the person responded with the same way I feel: We hope it's there for someone who needs it.
        Last edited by lynnifer; 06-26-2007, 05:31 AM.
        Roses are red. Tacos are enjoyable. Don't blame immigrants, because you're unemployable.

        T-11 Flaccid Paraplegic due to TM July 1985 @ age 12

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        • #5
          I'll try to keep this one short b/c I tend to ramble too much.

          In a word, NO I don't feel like anyone is obligated to pay me a welfare check (but, but.....). My feelings stem from the fact I used to be on SSI for many years as a child (deaf) and therefore not being allowed to work (my grandparents claimed I needed to concentrate more on classes in college, and look what happened). Then when eventually DID start working, much too late I might add, I got shut off. That part I didn't mind, but I came to realize i'd done myself a great disservice.

          BUT..........

          Some of us don't have a choice in needing all the care we can get. Period. I'm not one of those, but many here are. I was thinking and some ideas have half formed. I don't favor nationalized health care aka Canada and the UK, but damn if our system ain't screwed up costs wise too. Not having insurance is fine and dandy if youre young, employed, and healthy. But if you're severely disabled, then you're going to need a lot more resources and money than what you probably make to survive.

          So then, here's what I'm thinking. add to it as the thread goes along.

          -We need to have health care (medicaid, etc) and be able to work as much as we need to.
          - we need to find a way to avoid abuse of this system and encourage healthy adults to obtain and pay for their own health care until such time and circumstance as we can no longer do so, becoming eligible for this heath care.
          - In a nutshell, we need to increase the proportion the work force pays for its disabled and minor individuals with disabilities or children of disabled indiviuals.
          - Shift revenues and resources towards those who can't pay for their own health care.

          There's a lot I'm missing and of course there's a big fuzzy line between who's disabled and needs assistance and who can pay for their own care. Take my own example.........for me, maintenance care is actually fairly cheap, except my insulin (expensive). Catheters and supplies, not too expensive either. BUT if I get sick and end up in hospital, thats expensive. We need to figure out how to pay our own maintenance care provided its affordable and have some sort of insurance 'safety net' for those pricey hospital stays.

          Feel free to add your ideas, after all I'm just throwing some of this out there.

          Tom

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          • #6
            Tom lives in Utopia; just kidding Tom. lol

            Defination of disability has a lot to do with the problems in my opinion - such a grey area.
            Roses are red. Tacos are enjoyable. Don't blame immigrants, because you're unemployable.

            T-11 Flaccid Paraplegic due to TM July 1985 @ age 12

            Comment


            • #7
              I entered into a contract with the US government and paid my FICA (Federal Insurance Contributions Act) taxes (7 & 1/2% of my paycheck) for 6 long, hard, freezing cold and sweltering hot years of working the swingshift on the railroad in a steel mill and earned my monthly SSDI check and Medicare. Oh, and when I was hired there on my 18th birthday the interviewer and I were both smoking so I don't wanna hear crap from them about the cost of smoking on "the system". It takes both parties to change the terms of a contract.

              And the new Part D prescription drug plan is nothing more than Bush's (via the taxpayers) gift to Big Pharma. I didn't ask for it and it actually costs me money. The bastard.

              It doesn't give me a damn thing, I earned whatever pawtry "benefits" I receive.

              Bob.
              "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." - Philo of Alexandria

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by bob clark
                I entered into a contract with the US government and paid my FICA (Federal Insurance Contributions Act) taxes (7 & 1/2% of my paycheck) for 6 long, hard, freezing cold and sweltering hot years of working the swingshift on the railroad in a steel mill and earned my monthly SSDI check and Medicare. Oh, and when I was hired there on my 18th birthday the interviewer and I were both smoking so I don't wanna hear crap from them about the cost of smoking on "the system". It takes both parties to change the terms of a contract.

                And the new Part D prescription drug plan is nothing more than Bush's (via the taxpayers) gift to Big Pharma. I didn't ask for it and it actually costs me money. The bastard.

                It doesn't give me a damn thing, I earned whatever pawtry "benefits" I receive.

                Bob.
                I totally agree with Bob. If you paid into the system, you should be able to receive the benefits.
                Daniel

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by lynnifer
                  Tom lives in Utopia; just kidding Tom. lol

                  Defination of disability has a lot to do with the problems in my opinion - such a grey area.
                  LOL, no I'm afraid I live in Misery, not Missouri, not utopia. And right now I am in misery, suspect I may have either a stress fracture or blood clot on or near the side of the ball of my right foot. God, it hurts! been having a lot of swelling for quite sometime of both my legs and feet, and sitting here at this stupid computer like I do all night really makes ita lot worse. I think I had my right shoe on too tight at work on Sunday and something happened. Needless to say, I'm REAL worried. Yet, being uninsured, I'm in a bad spot. If it really is a blood clot then you know how serious (and expensive) that'll be. But the alternative could be a lot worse.

                  I agree with you on the gray area. where to draw the line? I guess I shoulda known better than to think we can ever have our cake and eat it too, but the throbbing foot is really making it hard to think.

                  Bob Clark, agree with ya too. We're all paying into a system already, yet it signally fails to deliver where its most desperately needed. Kinda wish we could just somehow wipe the slate clean (maybe thats why I was rambling above) and see if we couldn't start of fresh. Hell it could hardly be worse as it is now!

                  I'm gonna lie down and prop this leg up. I've drank too much fluids lately and need to let my kidneys clear some of this swelling, maybe that'll help....

                  Tom

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                  • #10
                    Kind of relavant:
                    http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2007/...ogy-costs.html
                    Roses are red. Tacos are enjoyable. Don't blame immigrants, because you're unemployable.

                    T-11 Flaccid Paraplegic due to TM July 1985 @ age 12

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by bob clark
                      I entered into a contract with the US government and paid my FICA (Federal Insurance Contributions Act) taxes (7 & 1/2% of my paycheck)
                      Bob.
                      moraq about fivca
                      if you were an employee's your employer matched your contributions to for ra total of 15 % fica
                      if yo were self employed then you would pay the full 15% into the system yourself.
                      the other down side to self employed is you get the same exact payout as the employees who puts in half as much as the self employed.
                      cauda equina

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        A lot of people really need this money, Social Security is a good thing. I would gladly give up my social security though if the Government got more involved in funding research, but there are some people who are dependent on their monthly checks, everybody is in a different situation.
                        "Life is about how you
                        respond to not only the
                        challenges you're dealt but
                        the challenges you seek...If
                        you have no goals, no
                        mountains to climb, your
                        soul dies".~Liz Fordred

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by metronycguy
                          moraq about fivca
                          if you were an employee's your employer matched your contributions to for ra total of 15 % fica
                          if yo were self employed then you would pay the full 15% into the system yourself.
                          the other down side to self employed is you get the same exact payout as the employees who puts in half as much as the self employed.
                          Yes, that's true. But if it wasn't government mandated then it would have been negotiated for during Management and Union contract agreements. Just like our Blue Cross/Blue Shield coverage was and vacations and sick leave etc. were. And then we negotiated for and got dental and eye coverage. Whoop-de-doo! Back in the 70's and even part of the 80s the Unions still held some clout.... at least up north. Now they're just shells of Unions. They'll come back when the people get sick and tired of being suckered. Although this time it will/must be a global uprising due to the new global economy.

                          Where do think U.S. Steel got their share of the 15% from? I'll tell ya where, from the hard labor of its employees. Corporations don't give anyone anything.. I think on that we all agree. And if it wasn't for our government allowing Japan and other countries to "dump" their government subsidized steel into this country without any tariffs to offset the dumping, we may still have a viable steel industry left here in the US.

                          The people are the real suckers in this sneaky scheme to end tariffs (BTW, the only taxes that supported our government when our Constitution was first ratified in 1787 were tariffs) with all these national and international corporate "free trade" agreements. How about some "fair trade" agreements? U.S. Steel became USX shortly after I left because they "read" the writing on the wall (inside trade secrets etc.) and diversified... plastics being one of their biggest new industries. Once, one of their biggest competitors!

                          Go figure.

                          Bob.
                          "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." - Philo of Alexandria

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Tom
                            Bob Clark, agree with ya too. We're all paying into a system already, yet it signally fails to deliver where its most desperately needed. Kinda wish we could just somehow wipe the slate clean (maybe thats why I was rambling above) and see if we couldn't start of fresh. Hell it could hardly be worse as it is now!

                            I'm gonna lie down and prop this leg up. I've drank too much fluids lately and need to let my kidneys clear some of this swelling, maybe that'll help....

                            Tom
                            Hi Tom,

                            I paid income taxes (the rates were much higher in the 70s when I worked... single people who weren't homeowners paid the most into the system because we had no deductions) to support the social programs for those who were unable to work because they were too young or disabled etc. I'd much rather my federal and state income taxes go to help people than to kill them over in Iraq at 3 billion dollars a damn week! Or in my particular case, to fund the Vietnam "War".

                            Bob.
                            "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." - Philo of Alexandria

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              This question cannot be answered for everyone outrightly. Like Bob says, he worked for years investing into the system. I was injured prior to working and fortunately my parents provide necessities for me, along with the monthly SSI. I do not feel the government is entitled to pay me, though I do feel the doctors' held responsibility. I didn't even know about SSI when I turned 18, my parents urged me to get it.

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