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    #76
    Originally posted by paramoto View Post
    I totally agree with your entitlement and victimization comment, i am the strongest self responsibility advocate. But I am also a strong believer in law and order. When there is a freaking sign, as there was in MIA, showing a wheelchair and asking people to leave the stall for disabled people, or something to that effect, I expect people to respect the rules.

    This is not an entitlement or victimization issue.
    It becomes an entitlement issue when you expect special treatment. The ADa is one big entitlement. Doesn't make it wrong. It becomes a victimization issue when you get mad about it. I think I understand your notion of law and order as it relates to the accessible stalls, and somewhat agree. Though, once a sense of expectation on account of an attribute sets in, and anger becomes the habit when one's expectations aren't met, that's what I'm talking about.

    Bigger (likely fewer) stalls for everyone isn't a great solution, IMo.

    Practicing patience, is. Practicing meeting failed expectations with dignity, is.

    We are the authors of our own reactions, including tying one's panties in a knot over the accessible stall not being available.

    I'm guess I'm not much for throwing tantrums on account of my circumstances and failed expectations. My habit is to look forward, not rile myself up looking backward, and, think its a good enough idea to share!
    "I have great faith in fools; self-confidence my friends call it." - Edgar Allen Poe

    "If you only know your side of an issue, you know nothing." -John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

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      #77
      Originally posted by DaleB View Post
      It becomes an entitlement issue when you expect special treatment. The ADa is one big entitlement. Doesn't make it wrong. It becomes a victimization issue when you get mad about it. I think I understand your notion of law and order as it relates to the accessible stalls, and somewhat agree. Though, once a sense of expectation on account of an attribute sets in, and anger becomes the habit when one's expectations aren't met, that's what I'm talking about.

      Bigger (likely fewer) stalls for everyone isn't a great solution, IMo.

      Practicing patience, is. Practicing meeting failed expectations with dignity, is.

      We are the authors of our own reactions, including tying one's panties in a knot over the accessible stall not being available.

      I'm guess I'm not much for throwing tantrums on account of my circumstances and failed expectations. My habit is to look forward, not rile myself up looking backward, and, think its a good enough idea to share!
      it's an excellent attitude! and i think cass was trying to express that. just do what needs to get done.
      "Smells like death in a bucket of chicken!"
      http://www.elportavoz.com/

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        #78
        I wouldn't mind a baby changing table in a handicapped stall-if it were the hight for a person in a wheelchair or a Little Person to change their baby on. I don't have a kid, but that seems to be the only reason to have a changing station in a HC stall.
        "Nothing ventured, nothing gained." - My Grammie

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          #79
          It rarely works out perfect for everyone in these situations. I was shopping yesterday and stopped in the restroom. Someone was of course in the stall. After I went in I heard a lady and some kids walk in. The baby changing station is on the wall across from the sink. Once I came out and washed my hands I could not get out of the bathroom because the baby changing table was folded down. There wasn't enough room to get by. I patiently waited for the sweet lady to change her baby and made conversation. It made me ponder about this thread. All we can do is practice patience and hope that as new buildings and shopping centers are built that these situations can be addressed.
          DFW TEXAS- T-10 since March 20th, 1994

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            #80
            Anyone else run into the odd accessible stall door that only swings into the stall, precluding the possibility of closing the door with a WC also in the stall? I find them from time to time.

            (Funny thing happened to me yesterday...my D's Locks cable broke while I was sidled up to a public John. When a D's cable lets go the hub locks are stuck locked, and need the guts of the pistons removed to unlock them. THAT was an adventure in an HC stall, sitting on the edge of my seat, legs to either side of the toilet, unable to move the chair even an inch! )
            "I have great faith in fools; self-confidence my friends call it." - Edgar Allen Poe

            "If you only know your side of an issue, you know nothing." -John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

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              #81
              Many years ago when my kids were small I'd bring them both into the larger stall with me so they were not alone in a strange rest room.
              Since the larger stalls are not marked handicapped I doubt most AB people know that that is what they are for.
              Obviously no one should sit in there and eat their lunch and use it as their own private break room though.
              I've been thinking about this since this thread began.
              Yesterday at the grocery store I went in to use the restroom. There is one large and one small stall. Someone was in the small stall. I REALLY had to go and used the large stall.
              Is this wrong since I am AB?
              Don't flame me-I am curious.
              I get frustrated when the family restroom is tiny or narrow door and can't get my husband in to empty his leg bag. I've become very creative and discreet.

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                #82
                Originally posted by LindaT View Post
                Yesterday at the grocery store I went in to use the restroom. There is one large and one small stall. Someone was in the small stall. I REALLY had to go and used the large stall.
                Is this wrong since I am AB?
                Don't flame me-I am curious.
                Not in the least bit. When you gotta go, you gotta go.

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                  #83
                  Originally posted by DaleB View Post
                  Anyone else run into the odd accessible stall door that only swings into the stall, precluding the possibility of closing the door with a WC also in the stall? I find them from time to time.

                  (Funny thing happened to me yesterday...my D's Locks cable broke while I was sidled up to a public John. When a D's cable lets go the hub locks are stuck locked, and need the guts of the pistons removed to unlock them. THAT was an adventure in an HC stall, sitting on the edge of my seat, legs to either side of the toilet, unable to move the chair even an inch! )
                  The crazy inward swinging door happened to me last Friday. My husband took me to an awesome Mexican restaurant. It was very nice inside so I assumed the bathrooms must be nice too. I drank 2 big iced teas during our lunch and had to go pee. Went in and a lady was in the stall crying. When she finally came out I tried to go in.......uh NO. The door was plenty wide but the stall was not deep enough for my chair even if the door did swing out. It was a long ride home with a bladder full of tea. The food was awesome. Too bad I won't be going back.
                  DFW TEXAS- T-10 since March 20th, 1994

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                    #84
                    the door going the wrong way is an easy fix. call the restaurant and inform them. you can also take pics. most ppl do this out of ignorance and sometimes lack of space for the door to open outwards but again, there are ways to fix this.
                    "Smells like death in a bucket of chicken!"
                    http://www.elportavoz.com/

                    Comment


                      #85
                      Originally posted by crypticgimp View Post
                      the door going the wrong way is an easy fix. call the restaurant and inform them. you can also take pics. most ppl do this out of ignorance and sometimes lack of space for the door to open outwards but again, there are ways to fix this.
                      I usually take the opportunity to put a human face on this issue, and, if I have time, try to fetch the manager right then. Took 3x at my local grocery store. Man, was the manager embarrassed the 2nd time she saw me, but the 3rd she was almost in tears humiliated for not doing anything about it, yet. Not my intention to upset the lady, but she obviously cared. Not so sure she would have with just a few calls, but I dunno.

                      LindaT: use away!

                      For me, I can't hold more than 400cc without invol'ing. I've cathed into a urinal in an emergency. Talk about getting weird looks.

                      "I have great faith in fools; self-confidence my friends call it." - Edgar Allen Poe

                      "If you only know your side of an issue, you know nothing." -John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

                      Comment


                        #86
                        Originally posted by DaleB View Post
                        I usually take the opportunity to put a human face on this issue, and, if I have time, try to fetch the manager right then. Took 3x at my local grocery store. Man, was the manager embarrassed the 2nd time she saw me, but the 3rd she was almost in tears humiliated for not doing anything about it, yet. Not my intention to upset the lady, but she obviously cared. Not so sure she would have with just a few calls, but I dunno.

                        LindaT: use away!

                        For me, I can't hold more than 400cc without invol'ing. I've cathed into a urinal in an emergency. Talk about getting weird looks.

                        in person is always best but seeing as offroader has already left, a call would be appropriate. i wouldnt let a door swinging the wrong way deter me from going to the restaurant, i'd just speak up about it and let them know. some things are easy to fix and it just needs to be brought to light.
                        "Smells like death in a bucket of chicken!"
                        http://www.elportavoz.com/

                        Comment


                          #87
                          Originally posted by crypticgimp View Post
                          in person is always best but seeing as offroader has already left, a call would be appropriate. i wouldnt let a door swinging the wrong way deter me from going to the restaurant, i'd just speak up about it and let them know. some things are easy to fix and it just needs to be brought to light.
                          Word.

                          I don't get deterred, either, due to inaccessibility, generally.

                          I didn't go strawberry picking yesterday, though, on account of how narrow the rows were, so, there's that.

                          Wasn't mad about it, just did something else for a while.



                          (I am in charge of the jam making, though! Plucking the greens off them as we speak...)
                          "I have great faith in fools; self-confidence my friends call it." - Edgar Allen Poe

                          "If you only know your side of an issue, you know nothing." -John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

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                            #88
                            Would this maybe be a good sign to have on the inside of HC stalls?
                            Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

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                              #89
                              Originally posted by DaleB View Post
                              Word.

                              I don't get deterred, either, due to inaccessibility, generally.

                              I didn't go strawberry picking yesterday, though, on account of how narrow the rows were, so, there's that.

                              Wasn't mad about it, just did something else for a while.



                              (I am in charge of the jam making, though! Plucking the greens off them as we speak...)
                              ah such is the nature of farming. not strawberry season here yet but homemade jam sound delicious!

                              my first reaction is peaceful advocacy. anger is always an extremely last resort and even then i just channel it into more advocacy.

                              and Linda, if the other stall is full, by all means use the bigger one. nothing wrong with that.
                              "Smells like death in a bucket of chicken!"
                              http://www.elportavoz.com/

                              Comment


                                #90
                                Originally posted by crypticgimp View Post
                                in person is always best but seeing as offroader has already left, a call would be appropriate. i wouldnt let a door swinging the wrong way deter me from going to the restaurant, i'd just speak up about it and let them know. some things are easy to fix and it just needs to be brought to light.
                                Unfortunately the stall is not deep enough that a chair would fit. It's a small bathroom that has no room to extend. Otherwise I would say something for a fixable issue such as a swinging door. My husband said the men's room stall was big enough to fit.
                                DFW TEXAS- T-10 since March 20th, 1994

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