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    #31
    Originally posted by Juke_spin View Post
    If you know people who's diets are the 2 Vs can be very healthy then why did you just say:



    I'm looking for any sensible input but try to be coherent. You agree with much of my stance, "and I actually agree with much of your stance on resources." but make your livelihood by helping the corporations keep the western world's populations deluded as to their true natures and focused on living up to the consumer goofy goals they delude then into wanting? Or how do you see what you work at for $$$ aside from the occasional effort for Green Peace?
    The first point is about economics and communities making a living, not nutrition. That was why I was trying to check what you were saying.

    If you're talking about a hyopthetical, idealistic world where the economies affected by fishing and farming don't count then fine. If not, you're stupendously naive.

    Don't debate me because of your assumptions about my job and lifestyle then if you want to be that childish. You know very little of what I do, who I do it for and the aims of those organisations.

    I've spent the past 2 years spending around 60 per cent of my time working on a project on sustainable food sourcing involving the UN, WWF and Greenpeace. Oh, I earned money working on it.
    Last edited by RehabRhino; 5 Feb 2009, 9:19 PM.
    C5/6 incomplete

    "I assume you all have guns and crack....."

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      #32
      Leif, you're so all over the map here it's near impossible finding viable discussion points. And you seem to think if you attack me:

      Originally posted by Leif View Post
      If peoples were not eating cows and pigs the cows and pigs would not have had a life at all, right. Thus eating them helps them have a life, straightforward logic. And this in fact proves that disillusioned Juke and Co. does not care about animals; they are just in the discussions for their personal humane hoopla PR., kind of. Pun intended Juke.
      ....I'll become confused enough to forget or let you redefine the thread. Not so. If I asked or underscored anything it's that every time we decide what food we will buy; every time we lift a bit of food into our mouths, we are casting a vote for how the human experiment will work out on Earth.

      At least you've not tried to make the claim of being concerned with the importance of people's eating habits as they reflect on global resources. Or the humanity of keeping pigs confined to cages stacked three high and too small for turning around; keeping them that way their entire lives. Your single observation, that the people responsible for the deplorable state of animal husbandry as it's practiced on a large scale are fine since they are responsible for the animals having life in the first place, is wrong. In modern societies there are laws deciding what standard of living, that's within their means, parents must provide for their children and what things they cannot do to them. Likewise there are such laws governing what people cannot do to/with their pets. Just because there are not yet such laws in place for the protection of meat animals doesn't make the abuse of these creatures alright.

      But back to the first point: you don't get to neutralize the significance and importance of how our eating practices impact the biosphere. You just don't. You're habituated into giving no critical thought to what you habitually eat. If you'd truly open your mind to examining those habits in light of that impact we'd have a starting point for discussion.

      Originally posted by Leif View Post
      Juke. Were all hookers by trade. But that has zero to do with you wanting all to eat grass. Like you want us all back to San Francisco smoking pot singing love songs like in the sixties – meanwhile the sane ones makes the earth move on. Really? For information, these days what you suggest and cling on is named laziness. If not in agreement to this, post what you do each week as for you’re hard labour to save this planet (meaning off course not what you put in you’re face each week). Can you post such or will you reply with attacks on the friendly person asking these important questions (me).
      Last edited by Juke_spin; 7 Feb 2009, 10:29 AM.
      "The world will not perish for want of wonders but for want of wonder."
      J.B.S.Haldane

      Comment


        #33
        Originally posted by Juke_spin View Post
        Leif, you're so all over the map here it's near impossible finding viable discussion points. And you seem to think if you attack me:



        ....I'll become confused enough to forget or let you redefine the thread. Not so. If I asked or underscored anything it's that every time we decide what food we will buy; every time we lift a bit of food into our mouths, we are casting a vote for how the human experiment will work out on planet Earth. At least you've not tried to make the claim of being concerned with the importance of people's eating habits as they reflect on global resources. Or the humanity of keeping pigs confined to cages stacked three high and too small for turning around; keeping them that way their entire lives. Your single observation, that the people responsible for the deplorable state of animal husbandry as it's practiced on a large scale are fine since they are responsible for the animals having life in the first place, is wrong. In modern societies there are laws deciding what standard of living, that's within their means, parents must provide for their children and what things they cannot do to them. Likewise there are such laws governing what people cannot do to/with their pets. Just because there are not yet such laws in place for the protection of meat animals doesn't make the abuse of these creatures alright.

        But back to the opening point: you don't get to neutralize the significance and importance of how our eating practices impact the biosphere. You just don't. You're habituated into giving no critical thought to what you habitually eat. If you'd truly open your mind to examining those habits in light of that impact we'd have a starting point for discussion.
        I take it you’re hungry.

        Comment


          #34
          Originally posted by Leif View Post
          I take it you’re hungry.
          Nope; just ate six big prawns w misos & supermayo on wholewheat bread. The misos made it too salty and I wound up scraping it off - but it was an experiment and they can't all work out.

          What experiments in eating have you indulged in in the last week.
          "The world will not perish for want of wonders but for want of wonder."
          J.B.S.Haldane

          Comment


            #35
            Eating last week? Today you mean

            Originally posted by Juke_spin View Post
            Nope; just ate six big prawns w misos & supermayo on wholewheat bread. The misos made it too salty and I wound up scraping it off - but it was an experiment and they can't all work out.

            What experiments in eating have you indulged in in the last week.
            Since you don’t believe me. I took a photo of the rest of the halibut and the super good shrimps. See below. I believe you can see the difference.

            Take care and enjoy you’re grass Juke.

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              #36
              Rekene

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                #37
                To much red beet might be a slice to much.

                Last edited by Leif; 6 Feb 2009, 4:07 AM.

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                  #38
                  A lot of farms that raise cattle for veal are now going free range and still produce the tasty soft beef that I love in my Schnitzel.

                  Stop Global Whining The CO2 produced from all of this whining is eating a hole in our ozone layer LOL

                  It has been shown that one volcano eruptions create 10 years worth of the same output of harmful gases from humans

                  The earth is a lot larger than people think and totally capable of handling anything we throw at it, give mother earth some credit!

                  As for global warming, scientists say we are actually heading towards another ice age thanks to the shift in the earths magnetic pole so I wouldn't worry about warming, I would worry about bundling up (of course the ice age will take hundreds of years to take effect so tell your great great great..... grandchildren to stay warm)
                  Ken

                  Guns don't kill people. Daddys with cute daughters do!

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                    #39
                    BigK, I agree with one of your statements, that being the planet can pretty much take what we throw at it. The issue has always been badly worded as far as I am concerned. Mother Earth will continue to spin no matter what, but the REAL issue is if we (humans) will still be around for the ride after we have polluted the planet past the point of human survival. The arguement for responsible living should never have been worded "save the planet" as much as "save the planet for humans and other animals."

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by Eileen View Post
                      BigK, I agree with one of your statements, that being the planet can pretty much take what we throw at it. The issue has always been badly worded as far as I am concerned. Mother Earth will continue to spin no matter what, but the REAL issue is if we (humans) will still be around for the ride after we have polluted the planet past the point of human survival. The arguement for responsible living should never have been worded "save the planet" as much as "save the planet for humans and other animals."
                      Eileen, once again mature, considerate reflection tops peanut gallery gleetster comments.

                      As you say, the earth will absorb most any pollution we throw at it; we can play the abusive clown and carp that we should:
                      Originally posted by BigK View Post
                      give mother earth some credit!
                      ...or seek mom's continued beneficence and give her at least the level of respect needed to make probable that she'll continue being a home for us. If we can't or won't do it for love we might well do it for trepidation; the Earth's displeasure with us might be expressed by our elimination.

                      Last edited by Juke_spin; 7 Feb 2009, 11:56 AM.
                      "The world will not perish for want of wonders but for want of wonder."
                      J.B.S.Haldane

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Input: "If you're talking about a hyopthetical, idealistic world where the economies affected by fishing and farming don't count then fine. If not, you're stupendously naive."

                        I never said everyone should eat veggie or vegan; that's a choice you've got as an option in a culture where you're surrounded by inducements to eat animals and sugar junk and highly processed and adulterated foods. It's hard and not very realistic to entreat people to eat a diet so radically different from what they've been accustomed to all their lives. Rome wasn't built in a day and the "Journey of a 1000 miles starts with the first step.".

                        To repeat myself from earlier in the thread, I'm neither veggie nor vegan. If we tip our diets in the direction of the Vs; away from those foods that necessitate killing poorly kept animals and absorbing huge planetary resources we improve the chances of people surviving and thriving on the planet. Earth winks at us.
                        Last edited by Juke_spin; 9 Feb 2009, 3:35 AM.
                        "The world will not perish for want of wonders but for want of wonder."
                        J.B.S.Haldane

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Originally posted by Juke_spin View Post
                          Input: "If you're talking about a hyopthetical, idealistic world where the economies affected by fishing and farming don't count then fine. If not, you're stupendously naive."

                          I never said everyone should eat veggie or vegan; that's a choice you've got as an option in a culture where you're surrounded by inducements to eat animals and sugar junk and highly processed and adulterated foods. It's hard and not very realistic to entreat people to eat a diet so radically different from what they've been accustomed to all their lives. Rome wasn't built in a day and the "Journey of a 1000 miles starts with the first footstep.".
                          I now accept you didn't, but I wasn't sure from your OP, that's why I asked you to clarify it.

                          I know you won't believe me because you seem to make judgements based on who you think I am but I think we are closer in agreement than you think on this topic.

                          I'm not a vegetarian but I totally agree that people are blindly conditioned to their meat rich diets and that the food industry requires radical change. This will only happen when consumers demand change.
                          C5/6 incomplete

                          "I assume you all have guns and crack....."

                          Comment


                            #43
                            Originally posted by RehabRhino View Post
                            I now accept you didn't, but I wasn't sure from your OP, that's why I asked you to clarify it.

                            I know you won't believe me because you seem to make judgements based on who you think I am but I think we are closer in agreement than you think on this topic.

                            I'm not a vegetarian but I totally agree that people are blindly conditioned to their meat rich diets and that the food industry requires radical change. This will only happen when consumers demand change.
                            If you can respond like this is a benign question: then are you at the nutritional responsibility chin music stage of dietary evolution?
                            "The world will not perish for want of wonders but for want of wonder."
                            J.B.S.Haldane

                            Comment


                              #44
                              Originally posted by RehabRhino View Post
                              I've spent the past 2 years spending around 60 per cent of my time working on a project on sustainable food sourcing involving the UN, WWF and Greenpeace. Oh, I earned money working on it.
                              You f@#king sell-out!

                              Chris.
                              Have you ever seen a human heart? It looks like a fist wrapped in blood! Larry in 'Closer', a play by Partick Marber

                              Comment


                                #45
                                Money is bad for you, Rhino. It's unconscionable that you would accept it for work better offered up pro bono. How do you sleep at night??

                                Because I am a philanthropist, and dammit, I CARE- I will accept some of the burden of excess cash, should it grow too heavy for you to bear.

                                When you speak of this in future years-and you will-Be kind.
                                Blog:
                                Does This Wheelchair Make My Ass Look Fat?

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