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Permobil M300 Corpus G3

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    #61
    Originally posted by gjnl View Post
    Let it be said...when you are trying to get a new power chair through Medicare, they require an Occupational/Physical Therapist evaluation and an attendant durable medical equipment supplier to validate the requirements that you need in a class 3 or 4 power chair. That said, in my experience (as I am going through this now), you need to be 4 or 5 pages ahead of all of them on the order form to assure you are getting what you need. My advise is to be absolutely sure of your needs, your measurements, and what is included and what is additional cost.

    The occupational or physical therapist that Medicare or maybe private pay insurance requires, who "quote" specifies your needs, is probably in league with a durable equipment medical supplier, with whom they work with all of the time. It is in your best interest to get a totally independent occupational or physical therapist evaluation, and then shop that evaluation around. I am in the middle of an OT (occupational therapist) and a supplier who work together all of the time.
    Maybe that explains why my evaluation was totally mixed up with the prior patient evaluated who had a pulmonary infection. The OT just didn't bother to change the diagnosis and codes.

    This OT and DME supplier just can't understand why I want to see every report they produce. I have an agreement with my doctor that he won't sign anything, until I tell him to. I'm not going to have the OT and DME supplier f.... this up and when Medicare denies, leave me to make an appeal. I've put the OT and DME supplier that I'm not putting up with their laziness and ineptness. There is never enough time to do it right, but always enough time to do it over!!!

    All the best,
    GJ
    What is happening is that medicare is getting so tight on what they want to pay DME a lot are looking for better jobs. Even my DME guy is great he is not gona work for 8 to 10 dollars a hour and he is looking for a better job. He loves his job, but medicare is just killing them on prices they will pay for things. I can see he is getting burned out and he told me what you gona get in the future is people they pay cheap that don't no crap and don't want the hassel of dealing with Medicare much longer. And there is so much paper work to fill out and not getting paid good you gona get crap because at that pay it take to long to fill out all that stuff for what they are getting paid they just don't care and you get the wrong stuff. Last year they had there medicare meeting wherever they have it. I think he said it was like a 3 day deal and the second day he said the the folks from U of M just got up and left over all the new crap that is going on.
    Last edited by Art454; 21 Nov 2016, 5:11 AM.
    Art

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      #62
      Originally posted by gjnl View Post
      Ouch! That is discouraging. I've had my Invacare TDX-SP for 7 years and have replaced batteries 3 times. That includes having to replace a set of batteries that physically failed (covered under warrantee), cases swelled and split. Those were Interstate batteries, not MKs. I'm probably a pretty light weight user of my chair compared to many. I don't depend on my wheelchair to take me long distances and I don't expect it to perform "off road."

      Individual battery usage...your mileage may vary depending on your usage.

      All the best,
      GJ
      Just get group 24 batteries and you won't have so much battery problems. Group 34 that my c300 has them in and I can see if they last a year I be lucky. Wish you could get group 27. More amp hours better off you are. I usally get at least 2 years on group 24 batteries sometimes 3 years if you can shock them back to life. My cordless keyboard is not typing right either dam it. Cordless keyboard last less than group 24 batteries....lol. I always get MK batteries....none better.
      Art

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        #63
        Originally posted by RollPositive View Post
        Turning radius is meaningless. If you take 3 chairs, all the same overall length and compare them

        Lets say each one is 50 inches from end to end.
        The front, rear, mid drive can all turn around in a corridor that is 51 inches wide...

        The mid drive one will have 25 inch turning radius.
        The rear drive, and front drive in extreme cases, can have the drive wheel right at the rear or the front. But they are now measured at about 45 inches turning radius. Even though they can turn in the same place.
        So what does it tell us? Nothing useful!

        It quite possible to have a mid drive chair that's 60 inches long that cannot turn in that corridor. And its got a shorter turning radius than the two that can...


        Front drive will be great at turning into a doorway because the longest part where it swings around is behind you where there's no obstruction is irrelevant. Likewise a rear drive is worse here, since all of the chair is in front of the drive wheels making it harder to turn into a doorway. You need to go almost past it, then turn...

        So what matters is good design. Central footplate, short chair. Anti tips or rear casters narrow. And wheels wherever you want them.

        And the central footplate has no "corners" to hit door frames as you turn. That makes it great in vans or indoors.
        IMO and 30 years in a power chair and having all 3 types...The mid wheel chair is the best for what I do.
        Art

        Comment


          #64
          Originally posted by Art454 View Post
          IMO and 30 years in a power chair and having all 3 types...The mid wheel chair is the best for what I do.
          That is key "best for what I do."

          All the best,
          GJ

          Comment


            #65
            After four iterations of the occupational therapists (OT) evaluation and the specification of the m300 by the durable medical equipment (DMW) supplier, all of the documentation looks right. The documents were faxed to my doctor today, and I could finally tell him he could sign off on the evaluation and specification. The OT had the most difficult time getting my diagnosis right and the DME supplier, just couldn't get the order right, but finally everything is meshing. Doc will sign off on the paper work tomorrow...fax it back to the supplier...and now we wait.

            More as things move forward.

            All the best,
            GJ

            Comment


              #66
              My doctor signed off on the paper work this morning and faxed the package back to the durable medical equipment supplier. The supplier/vendor faxed the paper work to Medicare. Now we wait.

              What is your experience...Medicare receiving the paper work until a Permobil wheelchair is delivered to you?

              All the best,
              GJ

              Comment


                #67
                Originally posted by gjnl View Post
                My doctor signed off on the paper work this morning and faxed the package back to the durable medical equipment supplier. The supplier/vendor faxed the paper work to Medicare. Now we wait.

                What is your experience...Medicare receiving the paper work until a Permobil wheelchair is delivered to you?

                All the best,
                GJ

                I would call Medicare in about 30 days just to make sure they got the paper work. DME's are terrible at follow through. I know people that just sat and waited only to find out in month 6 that Medicare never got the paper work and all the work expired.

                Or parts missing, so stay on top of them.

                Also check in with the DME I would use email so you have a trail of communication. If you dont get results with the ATP (rep that wrote the order) go up a level intill you get the results your looking for.

                Good Luck!

                Comment


                  #68
                  What ever works for you is great, I would never want to minimize something that is working for you or others.

                  I think though the difference is the c300 is a much older chair so the technology is not as new that would improve the ride experience like that of a F3 or F5 or even that of a m300


                  I remember when everyone was rear wheel and Pride came out with a mid wheel 6000 it was marketed that it had a smaller footprint. Which is very misleading people just need to understand the drive is not what makes the chair turn better its the end user.

                  Also on your comments on front wheel drive are off...the weight it forward over the drive tires so you will get more climbing in a front wheel drive with less slippage.

                  Mid wheel drive also can bottom out and get stuck on steep inclines that will require being pushed out. That doesn't happen with front wheel or if it does its less impacting

                  Last front wheel drive doesn't have front casters to spin and hit things like appliances in your home, able to get in tighter areas like bathroom stalls, subways, buses, cabs etc.

                  Your turns are more crisp and sharper.

                  I fly alot (monthly) and have noticed front wheel drive fly much better then when I was mid wheel because you can turn 180 to transfer in a tight airplane and go over jetways smoother to.

                  Years in a chair do not equate to more experience, but each of our needs are different but my experience is we dont like major change so if we are mid wheel users we will probably stay mid wheel because we dont want to risk the chance of changing mobility drives in fear.


                  I had major issues with my Pride Edge 1.0 mid wheel that I parked it and bought a used m300 with 3 miles on it and used it for a year and 1/2 and loved it.

                  I then started a new order for a m300 that would fit me better then the used one. Mid way though my order I demoed the F3 for 4 days, it was night and day difference regarding a much smoother ride. But the feeling of falling forward worried me. At the end of my 4 day demo I made the leap to try something new and so glad I did.

                  Again my posts are based on my experience 20 years in mobility, 9 chairs 3 Pride chairs, 1 Inavace, 1 Frontier x5, 3 Permobil

                  Also having a lot of industry contacts and friends helps me keep on top of whats real innovation, and whats marketing BS.

                  Dont forget the family at Wheelchair driver are crazy with there knowledge and experience and always willing to help us and our community.

                  http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/boar...f056fb4f56364c

                  Comment


                    #69
                    I fly alot (monthly) and have noticed front wheel drive fly much better then when I was mid wheel because you can turn 180 to transfer in a tight airplane and go over jetways smoother to.


                    I'm curious what you mean by this re: being able to transfer in a tight plane? I have never been able to get on a plane with my chair to transfer.

                    Comment


                      #70
                      Originally posted by gjnl View Post
                      My doctor signed off on the paper work this morning and faxed the package back to the durable medical equipment supplier. The supplier/vendor faxed the paper work to Medicare. Now we wait.

                      What is your experience...Medicare receiving the paper work until a Permobil wheelchair is delivered to you?

                      All the best,
                      GJ
                      4 to 6 weeks as long as things go right with Medicare.

                      Maybe the Holidays won't make it take longer.

                      Comment


                        #71
                        Originally posted by landrover View Post
                        I fly alot (monthly) and have noticed front wheel drive fly much better then when I was mid wheel because you can turn 180 to transfer in a tight airplane and go over jetways smoother to.


                        I'm curious what you mean by this re: being able to transfer in a tight plane? I have never been able to get on a plane with my chair to transfer.
                        When we fly we take your chair all the way in to the plane and then turn to transfer in to the 1st row seat (bulk head seats) a mid wheel drive chair you cant get in as far due to the front castors hitting the walls of the galley area. A front wheel drive doesnt have to casters so you turn in so much better then its also more simple for the ground crew to back up the chair so they can load it in the cargo hold below.

                        Comment


                          #72
                          I posted comments to Post #11 at this thread: https://www.carecure.net/forum/showt...ant-to-be-rich

                          The poster ("grommet") indicated earlier in the thread that he didn't have very good insurance and was paying out of pocket for his chairs. Others urged him to at least give the system a try. I started a "to do" list and hope others will add to it.


                          Originally posted by grommet View Post
                          Thank you for the support :-) Last night my girlfriend and I had a long talk about the Permobil and along with her encouragement the support I am getting from others like you, I am going to try. I talked to the Permobil rep and she said my last two chairs are that same category as the Permobil I want so I should be eligible. I'll try and make some phone calls this coming week and see. It feels like a pipe-dream and to avoid the insurance stress I am thinking about doing all I can to keep my current chair going but maybe I can try to make this happen. I keep thinking of all the bruises I won't have from leaning and falling trying to reach things if I had a better chair. That's why my girlfriend says it's worth it.
                          Medicare requires that you go through certain steps in the process. Private insurance may not require the same steps, but going through them anyway can only serve to strengthen your case.

                          • First, get a face to face appointment with your physician to discuss the need for a new chair of the type you require. Make sure he understands the classes of chairs available and that your level of injury and previous chairs you have used make you eligible for the Permobil class you are interested in. At this meeting get a referral to a physical (PT) or occupational (OT) therapist for a wheelchair/seating evaluation.
                          • Make the appointments with the physical or occupational therapist.
                          • Through your contact with the Permobil regional representative in your area, get a name(s) of durable medical suppliers. Check with your insurance company to make sure the durable medical equipment supplier(s) you are considering are approved. Medicare and some insurance companies require that you deal with a durable medical supplier that has either a certified ATP (Assistive Technology Professional) or and SMS (Seating and Mobility Specialist) on staff who will be working in concert with the OT or PT to specify the chair and accessories you require. Don't be backward about voicing your opinion and desire for a specific chair
                          • Make sure you get copies of the OT or PT evaluation, the letter of medical necessity, and the specifications of the chair and all accessories. Go over these documents very carefully and make sure the correct diagnosis codes have been used, the letter of medical necessity is thorough and complete and discusses why the chair and accessories are necessary. I went through 3 iterations before everything on these documents was correct. Chances are you doctor will know less about the chair than you do and he won't take the time to vouch everything. He'll just sign where ever there is a "Sign Here" message flag. I arranged with my doctor that he wouldn't sign anything until I had a chance to make sure everything was in order.
                          • Once the documents have been sent to your insurance company, call them and ask to be assigned to a special case worker who will be your liaison through the entire process. Stay in contact with the durable medical equipment company to make sure they respond in a timely manner if the insurance company has questions. Check in periodically with the regional Permobil rep so he/she can check on the manufacture and assembly process.


                          I'm sure there are other things to add to this list. I hope others will post their suggestion here or on the Permobil thread I started at: /forum/showthr...M300-Corpus-G3

                          All the best,
                          GJ

                          [IMG]/forum/clear.gif[/IMG]
                          Last edited by gjnl; 26 Nov 2016, 3:45 PM.

                          Comment


                            #73
                            Does anybody have any experience with or opinion of the anterior tilt feature of the Permobil? I tried it out when I had the demo in my home. It supposedly helps with reaching for things and doing some work for short periods when you need to lean forward, like writing checks etc.. I can see it having benefit, especially since it saves the shoulders from having to pull yourself forward out of the power chair back to reach for something.

                            As a quad we would only want to use it in the lower ranges as once the seat tilts you too far forward you could slide out of position.

                            Also I am awaiting to hear from my DME rep whether it is a covered or noncovered option.

                            Comment


                              #74
                              This from Mobility Management may answer some of your questions:
                              https://mobilitymgmt.com/directory/2...wer-bases.aspx

                              Anterior Tilt (F3/F5 Power Bases)


                              An ATP & Clinician Best Pick of 2015:
                              Anterior tilt as a power seat function has had limited availability in the industry and is not currently coded under the PDAC coding system. Despite these things, anterior tilt can provide exceptional benefits to wheelchair users both functionally and physiologically. For some, just a small change in orientation anteriorly can effectively manage tone and abnormal reflexes, which can often interfere with function. In addition, small amounts of anterior tilt lowers front seat-to-floor height and can be the difference between getting under a table/desk or being limited by the lower extremities. Many power wheelchair users would be able to use anterior tilt to assist with functional reach, making the user independent with performing mobility-related ADLs including self-care, hygiene, cooking, cleaning, laundry and much more! It is amazing how much access is improved with just 20? of anterior tilt! Even further, there are individuals who need to transfer out of their power wheelchair, but just don’t have the strength to do so. The 45? stand-pivot transfer package is ideal to assist with this task — making transfers much easier and allowing them to be performed independently.


                              All the best,
                              GJ

                              Comment


                                #75
                                medicare covered?

                                my DME says no, permobil rep says yes

                                imagine if the DME takes my money for a "non-covered" item and keeps it

                                that's serious

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