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    Permobil M300 Corpus G3

    I've been doing a great deal of research on rehab power chairs. Here is a quote from the Permobil M300 Corpus G3 web page on the Permobil site:

    The patent-pending Climbing and Traction Link system connects the drive wheels and casters and performs multiple functions, providing overall stability especially while climbing obstacles and traversing various surfaces. With the Climbing and Traction Link system, the M300 boasts unmatched climbing capabilities - 3" forward and 2" reverse. The large 8" casters and flat-free drive tires with gel inserts help absorb shock, while the solid steel struts lessen the impact of lateral forces. Plus, the Climbing and Traction Link system incorporates an oil-damped shock with a progressive tension spring, so performance can be adjusted to fit an individual's weight and lifestyle needs.

    It appears to me that to get the maximum performance out of the the Climbing and Traction Link system (3 inch forward climb and 2 inch backward climb) you need to select the tire/caster package that includes 8 inch casters and flat-free tires with gel inserts." Read this: http://www.permobilus.com/m300.php (paragraph at the top right hand side).

    Foam insert tires don't seem to be an option on the order form, only pneumatic or flat free gel filled.

    I know a couple of you are in the market to replace your Permobils with a new model. How are your durable medical suppliers interpreting these specifications regarding the Climbing and Traction Link system that is standard with the Permobil M300 Corpus G3?

    Have any of you who have had Permobil chairs before had the black tire option? Do they leave black marks on floors?

    All the best,
    GJ
    Last edited by gjnl; 30 Oct 2016, 10:41 PM.

    #2
    Never owned a permobil. Owned a handful of different name brands and front, rear and midwheel drives. Solid wheels I will NEVER use. Back/teeth/bone breakers. Kings of NO traction. Have never used a gel insert in a tire so I can neither vouch for nor detract from. Used grey tires and black. Never made a mark on any floor surface( I had white tile at one time) with said black tires. PREFER black, last waaaaaaaaay longer than the gray 'tires'. I use tubes in every chair I have ever owned. Great for absorbing shock, say you find yourself away from concrete fantasy land and in nature on a gravel road... no problem, reach down and let some air out to soften the ride, get traction and go. Want to get up a curb when you get back to concrete world? You ain't gonna do it with fred flintstone tires unless you are lucky. Have I ever had a flat in a power chair in 17 years of using them? Nope. Have had sloooow leaks and patched them about two times and twice replaced tubes when replacing tires. I have a chair sitting here I have drove with the two tubes I bought for it when I got it back in 2004. I have to find a rim for it because it was made from aluminum and has stripped out. Tube is still good. 'Foam' inserts are hard as a rock also. But all that said, I have to drive to see concrete. I still keep low pressure in my tires even inside.
    Best traction comes with tubes. Midwheel drive are going to get you stuck somewhere. Rearwheel takes skill inside and you can go thru tight spaces in reverse. Frontwheel is best inside but you have to back up steep hills resting the front anti-tips on the ground. TILT is invaluable on a powerchair, an absolute necessity. Hint: stay away from midwheel drive chairs. They are going to get you stuck.
    Last edited by CapnGimp; 31 Oct 2016, 1:43 AM. Reason: I spelled Fred's last name wrong, didn't want him to think I forgot.

    https://www.facebook.com/john.baxter.1213986

    Comment


      #3
      I wouldn't ever consider trying this myself but was surprised how easily it went up the incline. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl_inKBtiwM

      I've read others' comments about getting stuck using mid wheel drive chairs on uneven terrain.

      Comment


        #4
        The Permabil order form has two tire offerings Pneumatic and Flat Free. The order form doesn't mention if the Flat Free tires are gel or foam, but the write up in the on line brochure specifically says gel.

        I currently have an Ivacare TDX-SP, mid-wheel with foam filled tires. Rough ride! But, I don't do a lot of off road stuff with it. Some pavers and cobble walkways are killer, but I'm not in much danger of getting stuck.

        Re: the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl_inKBtiwM, above. I have a friend with a 30+? concrete driveway and I have to "tack" back and forth to get to the top. Looks like it would be a lot easier in a Permobil.

        Thursday, I'm going to the durable medical equipment supplier. He says he has 15 chairs on the showroom floor, variations of same models, that I can try out. I hope he has a couple that will fit my 6' 3" height. Being able to demo a wheelchair has never been easy at my height.

        Thanks for your comments.

        All the best,
        GJ
        Last edited by gjnl; 31 Oct 2016, 1:30 PM.

        Comment


          #5
          I'm 6'2". I know exactly what you are talking about. I have only been able to fit under about two tables since I was injured. Both of them I built. That's why I always use a tablespoon to eat with, less spills on the long trek to the mouth I go up and down much steeper hills than than the one in the video.

          https://www.facebook.com/john.baxter.1213986

          Comment


            #6
            Thanks for starting this post GJ. I have my seating eval Thursday. I ordered flat free tires with my current M300 and it came with foam filled ones. My hardest decision is deciding between 6 and 8 inch casters. Eight inch have advantages outside when going on rough terrain. I think the 6" would be better inside because the casters will not swing as wide when changing directions. that is a problem especially when I back out from my desk. On the other hand maybe that 1" less swing is really not significant.
            You will find a guide to preserving shoulder function @
            http://www.rstce.pitt.edu/RSTCE_Reso...imb_Injury.pdf

            See my personal webpage @
            http://cccforum55.freehostia.com/

            Comment


              #7
              Do you have to wait till the chair is 5 years old after you bought it to ask for a new one?
              Art

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Art454 View Post
                Do you have to wait till the chair is 5 years old after you bought it to ask for a new one?
                I've been told by an Occupational Therapist and a durable medical equipment supplier that Medicare will replace a power chair every 5 years.

                Here is a FAQ from the Hoveround website:
                https://www.hoveround.com/help/learn...placement-ruleMedicare's 5 Year Power Chair Replacement Rule


                March 12, 2013
                Question:
                Does Medicare cover replacement power wheelchairs?
                Answer: Currently, Medicare may cover a replacement power chair for eligible beneficiaries but only after five years of continuous use.1

                A five-year replacement policy for power wheelchairs ensures that disabled individuals with long term mobility assistance needs will retain the ability to safely get around their home and accomplish essential routines of everyday life.

                Some of the key points for understanding Medicare’s power wheelchair replacement benefit are offered below. Additional information may be found at Medicare.gov.
                Replacement Policy for Medicare Power Wheelchairs

                • Medicare may cover a replacement power chair after it has reached its reasonable useful lifetime.2
                • Reasonable useful lifetime (RUL) is estimated at, but no fewer than, five years. RUL begins on the date the recipient accepts the power wheelchair delivery.
                • After consistently operating the power chair for 5 years, the recipient may request a replacement.
                • In cases where the chair has sustained irreparable wear, Medicare considers the RUL of the equipment in its decision.
                • Medicare defines irreparable wear as deterioration resulting from day-to-day usage that is unrelated to any specific event or incident.
                • Medicare treats the request for a power wheelchair replacement as a new order. This means a face-to-face examination and detailed documentation of medical necessity must accompany the physician’s order for the power wheelchair.

                In cases when there is a change in the patient’s medical condition that requires a different configuration or power chair, Medicare may cover a replacement chair in sooner than 5 years

                All the best,
                GJ

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Art454 View Post
                  Do you have to wait till the chair is 5 years old after you bought it to ask for a new one?
                  Usually that is a requirement of Medicare and most other payers. Exceptions may be made if a person's condition has changed sufficiently to require a different wheelchair.
                  You will find a guide to preserving shoulder function @
                  http://www.rstce.pitt.edu/RSTCE_Reso...imb_Injury.pdf

                  See my personal webpage @
                  http://cccforum55.freehostia.com/

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by SCIfor55yrs. View Post
                    Thanks for starting this post GJ. I have my seating eval Thursday. I ordered flat free tires with my current M300 and it came with foam filled ones. My hardest decision is deciding between 6 and 8 inch casters. Eight inch have advantages outside when going on rough terrain. I think the 6" would be better inside because the casters will not swing as wide when changing directions. that is a problem especially when I back out from my desk. On the other hand maybe that 1" less swing is really not significant.
                    I had problems just using 5" inch on a manual chair indoors. My preference is two sizes, or rather two chairs, small 3" casters inside and 8" outside.
                    I have had periodic paralysis all my life. I lost my ability to walk in 2011 beginning with a spinal block, which was used for a hip fracture caused by periodic paralysis.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Eight inch casters will raise the height of the chair 1 inch higher than six inch casters, unless the caster wheels can be mounted higher in the caster forks.

                      All the best,
                      GJ

                      Comment


                        #12
                        gjnl Interesting how this played out, so you know my thoughts on Pride Edge so long story short version my Wife and I were in New York City on vacation and the crappy Edge left us stranded.

                        So I was so upset when we got back to our home city I parked the Edge and never used it again. Having it only 3 years my insurance would not cover a new chair so we bought a used m300 off Ebay it was a locally bought chair from my city and my DME confirmed they sold it and only had 3 miles.

                        I loved this chair it was strong, dependable, comfortable and reliable. We travel a lot by plane so it never got damaged on all our flights.

                        I used it for 1 1/2 years and then when my 5 year time line came up I ordered a new one fit for me. 1/2 way though my funding I had seen the F3 from Permobil but never test rode one.

                        So I worked with the Permobil rep and they brought one out to my house for 4 days. The rest is history, it did everything the m300 did but better, stronger and so much more comfortable!

                        I had a lot of people at Pride tell me Permobil had made major design flaws that would impact my usage..I had other experts tell me I would have issues navigating in a front wheel drive.

                        I have had a lot of chairs but this is by far the best chair ever!

                        One side note I have had center wheel drives high center and get stuck on steep ramps up and down and need a push to get on stuck.

                        With the F series have not once got stuck and ramps to steep for center wheel the F series rolls up and down with no need for help.

                        Not having the front castors makes it more simple to get close to things, doors, appliances, tight spaces much more simple.

                        On the issue of flat free or solid I use air filled it makes the ride to much more soft and not bone jarring.

                        We had a local bike shop add heavy duty slime that is used for mountain biking and no issues what so ever.

                        Last when looking at castor size cant compare a wheelchair to a power chair but the bigger the castor the smoother then crack, rock or bump.




                        Comment


                          #13
                          Here is my F3 going over a wooden pier, if the m300 I would have to stop ever so often because of the harness.

                          On the F3 it is so much smoother and no need to have to stop.


                          Comment


                            #14
                            Turning radius is critical for me in my house and in my van.
                            Permobil m300 - 20 inches
                            Permobil f3 - 26.5 inches

                            That is huge for my indoor use.

                            All the best,
                            GJ
                            Last edited by gjnl; 1 Nov 2016, 11:56 PM.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by gjnl;[URL="tel:1814422"
                              1814422[/URL]]Turning radius is critical for me in my house and in my van.
                              Permobil m300 - 20 inches
                              Permobil f3 - 26.5 inches

                              That is huge for my indoor use.

                              All the best,
                              GJ

                              Turing radius is like mileage ratings in moblity how it's measured and listed is very misleading!!!

                              Remember Pride Edge was to have a smaller footprint?

                              It doesn't it just looks better on paper.

                              I can tell you I can get in tighter places much more easy with front wheel drive!

                              Like I tell everyone you won't know if you don't demo.

                              Never rule out solely based on paper numbers...

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