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Ordered Frog Legs Double-Soft casters

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    Ordered Frog Legs Double-Soft casters

    http://www.froglegsinc.com/collectio...caster-4-x-1-4

    It's been a while since I first heard Frog Legs were working on a thicker tired caster in soft-roll (1 x 1.4"). Originally they seem to be heading towards 1" of rubber (Shore A 70 hardness). The current one, if I remember is 1/8" (same hardness). The idea was to give a softer ride with the extra rubber taking some of the bumps. I've been checking but the 1 inch thick didn't seem to be making it to market. They are offering for sale now the Double Soft (they are also calling it the Ultra Soft) with what I think is 1/2 inch of rubber. If you're confused now, welcome aboard. I think they make great stuff and are a great company and I think they are in the process of working out the nomenclature and numbers they will assign. But it is ready to order and I am ordering a pair. I'll report in the on the ride feel.

    I am checking these casters out to see if they can give me a softer ride at the footrest and I don't need to go all the way to the suspended Frog Legs casters. I do know they aren't the same thing. I think the suspended casters could be helpful with raised sidewalk sections making it less likely for me to notice the chair at eye level behind me that a moment earlier was right under me, but they would give a softer ride too. I also do know that with more rubber comes more weight but I don't care. I'm old and want the softest ride. I am still thinking about the suspended ones because I think there can be that safety factor but I don't know and it is a lot of money and I was due for new caster tires anyway.

    By the way, I recently got a durometer off eBay. Was worth $70, I bid at $7 and nobody bid against me so I got a pretty cool deal. It's an instrument for measuring the hardness of rubber (I got the type A, others work on gel or on the hard end, hard plastic). I actually did need one for a project but since I had it I thought to measure some wheelchair stuff too.

    My Schwalbe RightRun tires are 62A at the center strip, 72A on the grey rubber either side of the strip. SmartDrive rollers: 60A

    I know this is pure geek stuff but hey, Jill at Frog Legs got a kick out of hearing I had a durometer and said yep, 70A is what they make'm. :-)
    Last edited by grommet; 16 Sep 2015, 6:41 PM.

    #2
    Too funny about the durometer. I'll be curious to hear your take on the Double-Soft casters.
    Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by elarson View Post
      Too funny about the durometer. I'll be curious to hear your take on the Double-Soft casters.
      x2. I used to roller skate, and the wheels are rated for hardness, too. Softer (75?) for concrete, and harder (90?) for wood floors.
      Chas
      TiLite TR3
      Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
      I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

      "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
      <
      UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

      Comment


        #4
        You can see some of those double softs down on the right in yellow...

        https://www.facebook.com/FrogLegsInc...type=1&theater
        C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Brianm View Post
          You can see some of those double softs down on the right in yellow...

          https://www.facebook.com/FrogLegsInc...type=1&theater
          Thank you for the link. I don't know what they will be like but I will find out soon enough. As Frog Legs have told me, if I have 4 inch casters and order the Double Soft in 4 inch, they install a 3 inch hub to make up for the height difference of the extra rubber. But as I understand so far, they are making the tread 1/2 inch thick. Seems to me things will be sitting a .5 inch lower. Just meandering thoughts until I have them in hand. I am getting more and more curious about the suspended Frog Legs. I don't have any money now to get a pair but if the safety part is true it would be a great feeling to go down the sidewalk without being so frightened about sidewalk slabs that stick up. A while ago I did come out of my chair because I timed my wheely too late. Just a hair too late but I was tired. The idea that I could roll over stuff like that would be terrific. In many years I've only had that happen a few times and that's in thousands of miles but it's a worry I'd be glad to do without.

          These Double Soft won't help with that I expect but one product at a time. In all my time I seem to be working my way through most of the gear out there one at a time.

          Comment


            #6
            I took the Ultra Soft wheels out and it is a softer ride. Definitely noticeable. The wheels are not sized as exact replacements for 4 inch wheels, I found that out when installing them. They are 3 3/4". Frog Legs told me they were sized to replace. If you have some adjustment on your chair or fork, like using the lower hole, they should work. For some reason the pair I have aren't rolling free. My previous casters (Frog Legs) and all my others flew around with a spin. These won't. I didn't overtighten, I just tightened until the screw stopped. That's how I've installed all my wheels and they spin freely. Just details I thought to mention.

            I didn't have the chance to weigh the casters before I put them on so I can't give a comparison. They look heavier and I think with the extra rubber they might be but they also have smaller diameter wheels, maybe there is an offset or it isn't enough to matter. Don't know. Just to recap, the Ultra Soft are the same rubber as their other casters, but instead of 1/8" the tread is 1/2 inch. It looks like a donut :-) Because the ride is smoother I am glad I got them. I did like the light airy look of the originals but these have their own look.
            Last edited by grommet; 29 Sep 2015, 2:30 PM.

            Comment


              #7
              As always, another good review Grommet. Thank you. This may sound like a stupid question, but do you think the difference in outside diameter would be relative to the size? There is probably a better way to put that, but what I mean is do you think if we ordered the 5", instead of the 4" like you have, that the difference would still be 1/4"? It's a bit concerning that they are not spinning as well. Is it noticeable when using them?

              I was curious and just found a photo. They look quite different than what FrogLegs shows on their website, but not bad.

              Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by grommet View Post
                . . . For some reason the pair I have aren't rolling free. . . .
                Are the internal bearing spacers in place?
                Chas
                TiLite TR3
                Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
                I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

                "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
                <
                UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

                Comment


                  #9
                  elarson Yep, that picture is what I have. I do not know about your theory of scale in going to a larger size. I am not sure how they figured it when designing. 1/4 inch isn't so much though I would have liked them to be exactly the same size. I am confused why they are not since they both Frog Legs products. They told me to order the 4 inch to replace my 4 inch and explained that the hug would be 3 inches but the rubber would make up the difference. It's close.

                  I don't know about the free spinning. Maybe it's just my set. The thing is I have never had the problem before with any caster. I am using my SmartDrive every day now and will be a little while longer - doctor's orders. So I figure with the motor doing the pushing I wouldn't know the difference and maybe they would break in. I am looking forward to going for a walk without any motor and enjoying the freedom. Maybe I won't notice then either. They aren't frozen or anything they just don't move freely yet, the drag at the axle stops them as soon as they aren't being rotated. I think it's been a worthwhile experiment. The next step is to try the suspended Frog Legs but I don't know if I will ever do that. I will say one thing that might be slightly off-topic - the Frog Legs Unitine's are totally reliable and very strong.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by chasmengr View Post
                    Are the internal bearing spacers in place?

                    Yep, that was my first thought but they are there. I had to line them up with an allen key to get the axle through. Do you think there's a chance they are the tiniest bit short? I mean buy a hundredth or so? Then again I don't remember them spinning too freely in my hand before I mounted them. In all my years I don't know if I've every noticed (while moving) how my casters rotated. Maybe it's okay the way they are. Don't know.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by grommet View Post
                      Yep, that was my first thought but they are there. I had to line them up with an allen key to get the axle through. Do you think there's a chance they are the tiniest bit short? I mean buy a hundredth or so? Then again I don't remember them spinning too freely in my hand before I mounted them. In all my years I don't know if I've every noticed (while moving) how my casters rotated. Maybe it's okay the way they are. Don't know.
                      Have you asked FL about it?

                      Do you clean & lube your own bearings? If you removed your bearings, you could dx much better.
                      Chas
                      TiLite TR3
                      Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
                      I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

                      "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
                      <
                      UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by chasmengr View Post
                        Have you asked FL about it?

                        Do you clean & lube your own bearings? If you removed your bearings, you could dx much better.
                        Haven't asked Frog Legs about it. They are pretty nice. They might say if I want I can exchange them but I don't want to go through shipping stuff right now. Just sent back push rims and waiting for that to finish up (nothing to do with Frog Legs).

                        On the bearings - these casters are new out of the box with bearings and spacers, so I didn't think I would need to add lubrication. In the past I have changed out sets of bearings. Done that many times over the years and I have a few times lubed them too but cleaning them is usually more work than it's worth to me. You know, removing the seals etcetera. I would either lube or swap the bearings instead. I think these will be okay to run with. I'll find out for sure in a few weeks when I can start pushing on my own again without the SmartDrive. Heck, if I think about it, maybe I've ridden on some pretty slow dirty bearings in the past and never noticed so maybe no big deal having new slow ones. Hard to know what's important until I ride on something.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by grommet View Post
                          The next step is to try the suspended Frog Legs but I don't know if I will ever do that. I will say one thing that might be slightly off-topic - the Frog Legs Unitine's are totally reliable and very strong.
                          As one that uses the suspension forks, I wish I could address this better. Problem I have in addressing this is that I went from an old school chair using 8" casters to a TR with the suspension forks. I can say that I can feel them work. Example, when I go out the door of my house, there is a bump going through the threshold and I can feel the suspension work. That said, if s sidewalk crack is very big, it will stop the chair either way. If I come to a crack I still lift over it (or lean back). I do believe that they can deflect the issue of your chair abruptly stopping in certain situations. I have had them on both my TR chairs and if ordering a new chair I would again go with suspension forks, the new version TiLite now uses.
                          C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Thanks Brian. My last chair was a TR2 and I am still thinking I may get a TR3. The Icon helps with it's rear suspension but the front is a rough ride for me. That's why I went with the Ultra Soft casters. For me, going down hills fast is easier on my hands than braking slowly for a long time. This feels a little risky though because I worry about sticking a caster and falling out of the chair. I am hoping that Frog Legs suspended casters would add some safety but I appreciate you saying that you can still get stuck on some thing. Now I know it's not a guarantee I can float over everything if I go with the Frog Legs. Right now the thicker tires are giving a softer ride. Today I will be going down a hill and I can see how they feel then too. I wonder if I will ever find that perfect combination of all my equipment. It seems a never ending experiment. Though I can say as I've gotten older I care much less about style and more how things work. I guess I am coming over to the old-people polyester pants syndrome: forget how it looks if it's comfortable. Maybe I'll just start off with the polyester pantsuit and go from there ;-)

                            Comment


                              #15
                              LOL...hold out on the pant-suit...and pants!

                              The larger the casters you use the better they will roll over cracks, obviously. Going from my 8" pneumatic casters to 4" soft rolls with Frog Leg suspension forks was quite a change. On my current chair I went with 5" soft rolls and I prefer those to the 4" as they do roll over things a bit better and I don't notice any negative issues, such as them getting in the way more or being less responsive. You can always go with 6" casters, that would help with cracks a lot, but may deal with flutter issues. (My guess is that you don't want casters that big.)

                              I find it very odd that FL's didn't make their double-softs a perfect match size wise.
                              C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

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