ZX-1 Power Add-on owners thread

[elarson]

Hi Robotnik,

Our lithium batterties are Powerizer LiFePO4 from BatterySpace in the US. This is the spec sheet http://www.batteryspace.com/prod-specs/6912.pdf.

It is expensive to have them shipped from the US to Europe because they need extra handling because they are lithium. I found these batteries, which I think are fully compatible https://www.intercel.eu/pbq-life-15-12/. This is the spec sheet https://www.intercel.eu/media/datash...fe-15-12_3.pdf.

[elarson]

Attendant control mount / bracket

As a follow-up to posts about adding an attendant control to the ZX-1 (see posts #625 and later), we received the mount/bracket that Pat made for us. He used a motorcycle mirror mount and welded on a plate to screw into the attendant control. It fits perfectly!

The positioning is good for me to operate while walking behind the wheelchair. It is at a good height and angle so I can comfortably use it for a long walk, but hopefully low enough to not get knocked around too much.

We should now be able to go out and battle the bike paths in Amsterdam and I will be able take over as an attendant when things get a bit crazy, as they often do here. My husband said he will feel much less stressed having me on the attendant control.

Pat Tallino is a super star for helping us by making this mount! Who knows, maybe it is another thing he can license to Spinergy if other's are interested too.

I'm still finding the steering is a bit wonky for the attendant control joystick. It is not as easy to steer as the VR2 joystick and swings around a bit. I'm not sure if that is because of the location relative to the ZX-1, or some other reason. I had hoped it would be better with the better mount, which it is, but it is still not ideal.

I did a reorientation of the joystick again, as described in chapter 5 Dual Attendant System, section 5 of the the VR2 Technical Manual. Everything seems fine with the flashing light indications, but it is still not as good as the VR2 joystick. I've also tried adjusting the position of the mount as far forward as possible on the ZX-1 arm rest, and reorienting the joystick, but it is still not as easy as I think it should be.

The control system is programmed for drive profile operation, which as I understand, the dual attendant system will only adjust the speed within the selected profile. I'm wondering if I need to do a reorientation of the joystick within every profile also?

[robotnik]

Thanks for your help Ellen. You're right, these products are not easy to find... More, I was wanting to buy a bigger (in Amps) battery model to have a longer range, but I haven't seen one in the European's suppliers gallery...
At least if I want to buy directly in China with Alibaba, I've seen this one which has 24 A at a very affordable price. I guess it's compatible ...
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3288...c00TkPfJg&mp=1

[elarson]

Good to know there are other cheaper options. Please post if you find something that works with a longer range.

Thanks for your help Ellen. You're right, these products are not easy to find... More, I was wanting to buy a bigger (in Amps) battery model to have a longer range, but I haven't seen one in the European's suppliers gallery...
At least if I want to buy directly in China with Alibaba, I've seen this one which has 24 A at a very affordable price. I guess it's compatible ...
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3288...c00TkPfJg&mp=1

[krshirk]

Joystick woe's

Hi Gang! Im about 4 months into a joystick issue which I really want to get resolved ASAP with winter coming. I was using the ZX in my yard 4 months ago with no issues whatsoever. Came inside, plugged it in to charge, came back the following day to use it but was given a single blinking light code.....damnit!

since then i ruled out it being a battery issue, called spinergy about it, received extremely untimely poor customer service that resulted in me losing my good set of batteries due to lack of use and charging resulting from the issue, contacted my dme, argued with Spinergy (both my dme and I together) about it NOT being a battery problem. Spinergy finally agreed with us that its a faulty joystick, waited waaaay too long for them to get a simple quote to the dme, sent it to insurance to see about the repairs being paid for..............all for my insurance to tell me repairs are denied b/c i havent had it for at least 5 YEARS!!!!!!!!!!

My DME is teling me it will cost $500 to fix. Does this seem legit? i feel like they are trying to rip me off! Anyone know if/where i can purchase a new joystick??? It seems like a plug and play part to me......PLEASE, ANY HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATIVE!!!

KEITH

[elarson]

Hi Keith,

I can't help with insurance in the US and I don't know about pricing for repairs.

My guess is that you could replace the PG Drives VR2 Joystick Controller for less than $500, especially if you can find one used. The joystick is used on quite a few electric wheelchairs, so it should not be hard to source one. Keep in mind that you will probably need to reprogram it for the ZX-1 settings, but that should not cost you much from a DME.

Here is a link to the documentation in case you don't have it. I'm not sure if it will be the same version as yours though. http://sunrise.pgdrivestechnology.co...SK77898-05.pdf

[krshirk]

Hi Keith,

I can't help with insurance in the US and I don't know about pricing for repairs.

My guess is that you could replace the PG Drives VR2 Joystick Controller for less than $500, especially if you can find one used. The joystick is used on quite a few electric wheelchairs, so it should not be hard to source one. Keep in mind that you will probably need to reprogram it for the ZX-1 settings, but that should not cost you much from a DME.

Here is a link to the documentation in case you don't have it. I'm not sure if it will be the same version as yours though. http://sunrise.pgdrivestechnology.co...SK77898-05.pdf

Thanks for your help elarson! I will look into it! Do you happen to have a contact with the original inventor Builder?

Anybody else out there in the Community got some Intel?

[pattherat]

Thanks for your help elarson! I will look into it! Do you happen to have a contact with the original inventor Builder?

Anybody else out there in the Community got some Intel?

I agree with Elarson's advice. These are a fairly common joystick used on a number of different manufacturer's powerchairs. There are many new, used and rebuilt VR2 joysticks for sale on eBay, just make sure it has the actuator function(extra 2 buttons with seat symbols). It is just plug and play, no programming is necessary.

Here is a link to VR2 flash codes: https://support.pgdt.com/Online-Diag...R2-Flash-Codes

I'm sure you've tried new batteries and checked all the battery connections, you may also want to try bypassing the 50 amp fuse that connects the two batteries.

[robotnik]

Hi everybody (and for help, battery specialists)
Is there anything to know, or something to do, after a battery change ?
I've bought mine directly from China (they all come from China anyway...), they seem to have the same specs (see below) but... they don't work !!
My ZX-1 seems to roll at average speed, but shuts down very abruptly if I ask for max speed ! Any idea ? Something I missed ?

[pfcs49]

the peak discharge rate may be too low and the battery shuts down to protect itself? My ZX-1 with SLA batteries pulls well over 15A on hills at full throttle. I've seen 37A in spurts.
Thanks for being the tip of the spear on this. I have stayed in my foxhole until someone more adventurous figures out what aftermarket battery fits and works well.
I recently archived this which looks promising:https://www.powertechsystems.eu/home...ck-powerbrick/
Although too big for the ZX1 in original configuration, I could cut the locating tab and move it aft a bit, and they could be put in on their sides. This would certainly provide a very long range if these batteries are any good.
good luck!

[robotnik]

the peak discharge rate may be too low and the battery shuts down to protect itself?

I think you're right, pcfs49 !
It seems to be the main difference between the OEM batt and the Chinese aftermarket mine. On the specs, there's a huge gap between the "continuous discharge current" of the std LifePo4 mounted on the ZX-1 and that can offer the one I've bought !
That said, I've found in France (finally) a product that matches, but ... there's also a big gap in the price ! They are at 250? here, instead of the Chinese model : 98? only. Maybe it's also an explanation.
I had a look at the website https://www.powertechsystems.eu/home...ck-powerbrick/ and these products look fine (and they are french !) but I don't understand how the "powerbrick" can fit the ZX-1, even on the side. There's not enough room under the hood IMHO ?
I have a question for you pcfs49 (and other batteries masters) : What about swapping from LifePo4 (the current batts) to Li-Ion ?
I've seen Li-ion were less expensive and with the same enclosure, could be more powerful (I've seen 12V/20A on Alibaba) so a better range...
Of course LifePo4 are safer, but I don't need to take a airplane with my ZX-1 anyway.
What about the charger, and the monitor ? are they compatible ? I don't want to toast all that stuff...

[robotnik]

Hi all,
I've ended by buying, for my LiFePo4 batteries (that weren't with the good specs) 2 BMS that the China Guy told me they were OK.
But even with the good BMS, even fully charged, my ZX-1 doesn't work well at full speed. It looks like it doesn't "see" the batteries are full. Did I miss something ? Is there a reset to do when swapping the batts ?

[pfcs49]

No help here but thanks for doing this!

[maddog]

Hi all,
I've ended by buying, for my LiFePo4 batteries (that weren't with the good specs) 2 BMS that the China Guy told me they were OK.
But even with the good BMS, even fully charged, my ZX-1 doesn't work well at full speed. It looks like it doesn't "see" the batteries are full.

I have no knowledge of the zx-1 but do have a little in swapping to different battery chemistries. Have you put a multi-meter on the battery to see what a full charge voltage is? Are you sure you have lifepo4 cells? Lifepo4 cells are 3.2v and will nicely make a 12v battery. Li-ion cells charge to 3.7v to either make 11v or 15v. 12v does not work well with li-ion, 24v does work well because you use 7 cells but you can't divide 7 in half to make 12v. You may have a 3s or 11v li-ion pack which is why your battery is under performing.
The most likely case is you are experiencing what I am going through and your lifepo4 batteries can't handle the Amps needed especially at full speed. You are probably seeing significant voltage drop under heavy load. Many battery companies are notorious for over hyping the battery specs. I just built a pack rated at 20A for my iglide that needs at most about 15A but it really struggles. I have found get a name brand battery and make sure the amp rating is well above your needs.

[nonoise]

Hi all,
I've ended by buying, for my LiFePo4 batteries (that weren't with the good specs) 2 BMS that the China Guy told me they were OK.
But even with the good BMS, even fully charged, my ZX-1 doesn't work well at full speed. It looks like it doesn't "see" the batteries are full. Did I miss something ? Is there a reset to do when swapping the batts ?

Repeating what Maddog said about getting genuine factory, correctly rated batteries and that they are rated high enough.

This is from post 744 above (I think)
The online ZX-1 manual shows:

==================paste=====================
Lead: 12 volt, 15 Ah (2). AGM. 5 - hr. capacity = 12.75 ah.

Lithium: LiFePO4 12 volt 15 Ah

But what is better, it confirms what others have been saying for battery range:
5 miles Minimum w/ Lead and 9 miles Minimum with Lithium Batteries
=================end paste==========================
The source of the ZX-1 User Manual is here, but I could not get much of it to load today.
https://manualzz.com/doc/6883887/zx-1-user-manual

So what are your batteries rated at? I doubt you have a BMS issue unless something went wrong wiring the second one.