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    I'm not following what you said. Will you highlight, if you can, the part where you say *how* the second set of ZRA armrests will be used?
    Secondly, why won't any set of one inch outside diameter of armrests work? You can cut them off and drill the req'd holes to match.
    I have had periodic paralysis all my life. I lost my ability to walk in 2011 beginning with a spinal block, which was used for a hip fracture caused by periodic paralysis.

    Comment


      When you get a chance to comment, I believe there are armrest/side guard combos that fit into a slot-receptacle mounted on the horizontal wheelchair tubing at the seat area. (Sorry if I have misunderstood this issue.)
      Yes they would be more difficult to remove and replace into the receptacle if your husband needs to do this himself. Also, if removed to get into the ZX1, the user would then be without the sideguards ("clothing guard"). But, just wondering if that was considered for armrests when not in ZX1.

      I like those flip up side guards, did not know they were available. I must lift mine up and out every time I transfer, then fuss around trying to fit them back in place when transferring back into wheelchair (TiLite). I would like to occasionally use armrests when not in ZX1, but, alas, not up for doing the work, or using those combos mentioned, as I definitely need my sideguards when in chair.

      Comment


        We would need one extra armrest for option 3) Use one ZRA armrest and fit the ZX-1 joystick to it. I just updated the parts because we would also still need the arm stop parts. Probably most one inch outside diameter of armrests would work as long as they are a similar size to the ZRA. It's the arm stops that are specific to the type of hardware used for the chair. So yes, probably we could test this by having any similar size armrest as long as we have the correct arm stop.
        Originally posted by nonoise View Post
        I'm not following what you said. Will you highlight, if you can, the part where you say *how* the second set of ZRA armrests will be used?
        Secondly, why won't any set of one inch outside diameter of armrests work? You can cut them off and drill the req'd holes to match.
        Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

        Comment


          I'm not sure to follow you too ...
          And after a close look to your picts, I would have suggest you to :
          - remove the ZX-1 armrest brackets (and of course, its armrests)
          - Keep in place, well adjusted, the anti-tip system (I'm not sure you need absolutely a backup here)
          - use only your ZRA's armrest brackets and its armrest (best fit, well adjusted to Rob and the chair)
          - find a nice&easy solution to put the joystick at the end of the ZRA's armrest, removeable when the ZX-1 is unhooked.
          But I've forgotten something maybe ?

          added: this mod (removing the ZX-1 armrest brackets) gives you the choice to use the armrests you want (ZRA or ZX-1).
          But may be you can only move them out of the way for the ZRA armrest brackets.
          Last edited by robotnik; 2 Apr 2015, 12:29 PM.
          C6-7 since mid 2002, no hand control nor triceps.
          my website & my job (in France): Accessibility advisor www.acceslibre.eu
          Also working on a French research about Peer counseling and Empowerment.

          Comment


            Pat had mentioned using a "T-style" armrest also, and this was my reply:
            My husband has had the "T-style" desk arms with rigid side guards on another chair and we both hated them. They were heavy, hard to get off for transfers, and rattled around a lot. He now has an ADI seatbase with fold down sideguards and swing-away armrests that work very well for him.
            I noticed in the options catalog there are 2 new styles of armrests: 2-Point Flip Back Desk Armrest. It looks like the bracket would also get in the way of the ZX-1 armrest though, and I can't find them in the Parts Store to check. Here is a photo of all of the armrests:
            Click image for larger version

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            Originally posted by triumph View Post
            When you get a chance to comment, I believe there are armrest/side guard combos that fit into a slot-receptacle mounted on the horizontal wheelchair tubing at the seat area. (Sorry if I have misunderstood this issue.)
            Yes they would be more difficult to remove and replace into the receptacle if your husband needs to do this himself. Also, if removed to get into the ZX1, the user would then be without the sideguards ("clothing guard"). But, just wondering if that was considered for armrests when not in ZX1.
            I think you might mean the Swing Away - Flip Back armrests? My husband has them on his other chair. Indeed they are the easiest with transfers. They are a bit heavier and I have to keep them adjusted, but overall they work well.
            I like those flip up side guards, did not know they were available. I must lift mine up and out every time I transfer, then fuss around trying to fit them back in place when transferring back into wheelchair (TiLite). I would like to occasionally use armrests when not in ZX1, but, alas, not up for doing the work, or using those combos mentioned, as I definitely need my sideguards when in chair.
            Last edited by elarson; 3 Apr 2015, 2:43 PM.
            Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

            Comment


              Thanks Robotnik. I probably made that post a bit more complicated than need be. I was trying to work it out in my head as I typed. Now you know just how crazy I am .

              I am leaning towards what you wrote, which is option 3, but I want to try all 3 options. I think I can test option 1 and 2 this weekend with hardware I have around the house. Even if it's not perfect I should be able to test it temporarily.

              For option 3, I really would prefer a separate armrest that works with the ZRA -- we would only need one of them. Although I think I could drill holes in the armrest we have and use one of the joystick extenders we have that has a detent on it to connect, it will mean taking off the foam to drill a through hole and cutting the foam away from the front. Once I put the foam back on, I don't think it would be easy to connect/reconnect the detent (it's small), so it would be best if it was permanent. Here is a photo of the joystick extender if you are curious:
              Click image for larger version

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              Originally posted by robotnik View Post
              I'm not sure to follow you too ...
              And after a close look to your picts, I would have suggest you to :
              - remove the ZX-1 armrest brackets (and of course, its armrests)
              - Keep in place, well adjusted, the anti-tip system (I'm not sure you need absolutely a backup here)
              - use only your ZRA's armrest brackets and its armrest (best fit, well adjusted to Rob and the chair)
              - find a nice&easy solution to put the joystick at the end of the ZRA's armrest, removeable when the ZX-1 is unhooked.
              But I've forgotten something maybe ?

              added: this mod (removing the ZX-1 armrest brackets) gives you the choice to use the armrests you want (ZRA or ZX-1).
              But may be you can only move them out of the way for the ZRA armrest brackets.
              Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

              Comment


                Option 3 makes the most sense. I don't know why I didn't see it the first time. I have 2 1/2 sets of extra L armrests but I've forgotten which brands are which. None have holes like yours. So if needed, shout out.
                I have had periodic paralysis all my life. I lost my ability to walk in 2011 beginning with a spinal block, which was used for a hip fracture caused by periodic paralysis.

                Comment


                  Thanks Nonoise. I may take you up on that. We've been hit with a lot of expenses lately and paying what appears to be at least $75 for one armrest for this purpose seems a bit steep. If you get the chance, can you take a photo of your right armrests (we would only need one right)?

                  Originally posted by nonoise View Post
                  Option 3 makes the most sense. I don't know why I didn't see it the first time. I have 2 1/2 sets of extra L armrests but I've forgotten which brands are which. None have holes like yours. So if needed, shout out.
                  Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

                  Comment


                    I wonder which is the right one? Do the armrests bulge out as they get up to the hands on end or do the two get closer together?
                    I have had periodic paralysis all my life. I lost my ability to walk in 2011 beginning with a spinal block, which was used for a hip fracture caused by periodic paralysis.

                    Comment


                      They usually bulge out right before the bend as they get up to the hands on end. That's because they are mounted vertically behind the back post and need to get around it.
                      Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by elarson View Post
                        They usually bulge out right before the bend as they get up to the hands on end. That's because they are mounted vertically behind the back post and need to get around it.
                        This is a right hand arm rest taped to a 18 X 24 inch carpenters square. It fits my ZR ver. 1.
                        Click image for larger version

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                        I have had periodic paralysis all my life. I lost my ability to walk in 2011 beginning with a spinal block, which was used for a hip fracture caused by periodic paralysis.

                        Comment


                          Nonoise, if you are up for the hassle, let me figure out if the armrest you posted might work. It looks like it would. PM me and we can talk costs. We have a few neighbours with drill presses, so I think we can sort out the through holes. I so don't want to muck-up his good armrests -- I've learned that the hard way with experimentation and no back-ups.

                          I figured out a way to test option 2) and 3) better, without all of the hassles of trying to order parts to test with the arm stop on the ZRA. I was able to take the screw/pin and bolt from the ZX-1 armrest bracket and attach it to the ZRA arm stop. It's not snug and has some play, but will be good enough to test, once I drill through holes in the arrmrests.

                          I think this is testimony to Pat's KISS approach "Keep it simple, stupid" by using standard available parts. I can't say how much I appreciate engineers that do that. Less is more when it comes to wheelchair design and maintenance, and designing the next best thing is not always the wisest for the user.

                          Thanks to listening to all of my missives.
                          Last edited by elarson; 4 Apr 2015, 4:47 AM.
                          Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

                          Comment


                            It looks like that would work. There is enough room under the bend to make it a good height. I'll PM you.

                            Originally posted by nonoise View Post
                            This is a right hand arm rest taped to a 18 X 24 inch carpenters square. It fits my ZR ver. 1.
                            Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

                            Comment


                              I was able to take off the armrest bracket and do basic testing with only having the anti-tilt mechanism. Pat really was right when he said engaging and disengaging would be difficult. When you don't have the armrests on the ZX-1 the little bugger takes off in all directions and it's really hard to navigate it by holding the armrest. The lining up to engage/disengage was not so bad, but I really think it would be better to have the armrest brackets in place.

                              I was not able to test with having the armrest brackets on because I did not have enough fasteners, but I just ordered some. I couldn't find 316 marine stainless, which is what is printed on the washer, but I think A2 (304, 18/8) stainless will be okay because he does not use it much in wet conditions. I sure hope these will work, because I have a heck of a time figuring out the correct fastener sizes with all of the different international standards.

                              8) M6X25mm Button Head Hex Socket Cap Screw Stainless A2 ISO 7380 [this was edited]
                              8) M6 Nylock Nuts Stainless A2 DIN 985
                              8) M6 Washer 18 OD Stainless A2 DIN 9021

                              Pat, if you happen to know the screw size for the armrest / anti-tilt brackets can you let me know?
                              Last edited by elarson; 8 Apr 2015, 6:16 PM. Reason: Edited to correct the screws used
                              Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

                              Comment


                                I think I am making progress. I was able to test option 1) Use the ZX-1 armrests and ZX-1 armrest brackets as mentioned in my previous post. From what I am seeing with basic testing, this might work. With the the anti-tilt mechanism at the optimal setting of 3" to match the 3" COG on the ZRA and the armrest brackets moved back to 5", there appears to be plenty of room to to tilt the chair back without the ZRA armrest brackets coming into contact with the ZX-1 armrest brackets. The only problem I encountered is that there is not enough space on the upper armrest bracket hole to insert a washer because it conflicts with the upper horizontal member of the anti-tilt mechanism bracket. I don't think this is a big issue.

                                Sorry if these photo's aren't so good, but I would be interested in hearing any input.

                                If anyone can post similar side views of the ZX-1 configured properly without wheelchair armrest brackets, I would be interested to see how they compare. Be sure to take the wheelchair wheel off or it's hard to see everything.

                                Click image for larger version

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                                Last edited by elarson; 8 Apr 2015, 7:57 PM.
                                Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

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