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    #46
    Originally posted by Brianm View Post
    3) The chair rocks when brakes are applied
    Nature of the beast with any brake/lock that locks at the hub. If you watch what's rocking you'll notice the hubs stay perfectly stationary, the "rock" occurs because of the flex of the spokes. It is possible to increase the spoke tension to minimize the play.. You will get used to it, in time you will trust them.

    fwiw every guy I know with them (ADI disc brakes) comes to love them once they are set-up and they are relatively trouble-free. Just be careful getting the chair in and out of the car and harp on the baggage handlers when getting out of it to get on an airplane. Let them know it's better if they don't remove the wheels.

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      #47
      Originally posted by elarson View Post
      . . .We have another set of Spinergys (same size) and it kind of stinks that I could not swap them out if we were short on time (which is most of the time;-) . . .
      You could choose to have ADI install drive splines into your spare set of wheels.
      Chas
      TiLite TR3
      Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
      I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

      "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
      <
      UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

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        #48
        Originally posted by chasmengr View Post

        4) any disc brake system will need frequent adjusting when it's new. The pads need setting; the cables need stretching. After some initial use (a month or so) they should settle in. And, unlike a bicycle where applying the new brakes doesn't turn you, applying new brakes on a wheelchair will be annoying (especially single-lever actuation) because the two sides won't settle in exactly together, thus turning the chair until they settle in. On a car, the brakes are linked in an X pattern (front left to right rear), so uneven pull is less noticeable (and for safety).
        The best way to ensure that two disc brakes actuate simultaneously with identical pressure is to use a hydraulic system, not mechanical.

        I have an offroad handcycle with two wheels up front & one in the rear, each with disc brakes – hydro up front (w/ single-lever actuation) & cable-driven in the rear.

        Comment


          #49
          Originally posted by -scott- View Post
          The best way to ensure that two disc brakes actuate simultaneously with identical pressure is to use a hydraulic system, not mechanical.
          Absolutely! I had cable on my mind when writing that (because ADI's are cable actuated). Cars of course use hydraulic brake actuation. And bicycle disc-brake systems are available in hydraulic.

          I wonder . . are ADI's convertible to hydraulic?
          Chas
          TiLite TR3
          Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
          I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

          "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
          <
          UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

          Comment


            #50
            I've only been doing the heavier research because there are some available used. I think otherwise, I would have been clouded with all the positives too. They are very compelling. Don't be hard on yourself.

            I guess I don't understand why this technology is not more standard on higher end wheelchairs. All of the parts are from the bicycle industry and have been available for some time Hydraulic Disc Brakes. Granted, I can understand that they may not be available on all types of chairs and wheels, the average consumer should not need to cut their camber tube or insert a spline drive to use them.

            The jury is still out on our decision, but that is also because we are considering a power add-on, and for most of the situations where variable brakes would be used, i.e., descending, we think the power add-on would be used instead.

            Mostly what I hear about ADI's is very good. Good luck, and hope they work well for you.

            Originally posted by Brianm View Post
            Thank you.

            Yes, this is where I was foolish and should have done some research; I believe I can reverse what they have done, but it will be a costly mistake, not to mention the hassle if I do. I had a vision of the positives and it clouded any other judgement.

            I think they do, or did, modify the existing camber tube. They either changed doing that or they at least did for mine, as they sent me my stock camber tube.

            Having not used them, I don't know how often adjustments would be needed, I would tend to think not often as they are bike brakes.
            Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

            Comment


              #51
              Originally posted by chasmengr View Post
              I wonder . . are ADI's convertible to hydraulic?
              Perhaps, though if yes, everything from the lever to the caliper (and in-between) would need to be replaced. It wouldn't be a cost-effective modification.

              Comment


                #52
                Personally, I would not like the maintenance involved with hydraulic brakes, but then again, I am a weenie. In my discussions with my bicycle designer/engineer brother about building our own hydraulic brakes, this Disc Brake Bleed Kit made me run for cover. Of course my brother pointed out that if I can bleed kegarator lines, I can do this. Just not the same joy in that according to me.

                Originally posted by chasmengr View Post
                I wonder . . are ADI's convertible to hydraulic?
                Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

                Comment


                  #53
                  I have been using the chair full time for about a week now and I am very happy to report back how pleased I am with this chair, I only wish I had a setup like this 20+ years ago, I believe my arms and shoulders would be in a lot better shape today.

                  Going with 25" wheels instead of 24" has made a big improvement for me in my reach for the wheels, it can't be emphasized enough how much difference this has made. I would also like to note that for my custom hand-rims, instead of simply making them 1" bigger in diameter for the 1" bigger wheel compared to my other chair, I made them another 3/4" inch bigger in diameter, pushing the projections further out, therefore closer in reach.

                  I haven't used the chair enough to say a lot about going from 4" casters to the 5", but my initial impressions, for me, is positive. There are a number of bumps around my house that are noticeably smoother and easier with the 5's.
                  I recall noticing with my previous chair that it took a number of months for the frog leg forks to break-in, soften up; I expect the same from my current ones, so an actual apples-to-apples could be some time off.

                  I have had to get back in my old chair a couple times last weekend and even after only being in the new chair a short time I found it amazing I ever liked my old setup, the big difference being the reach for the wheels. While the changes seem somewhat subtle, they made a big difference. Three years ago when I went from my stretched out Quickie 2 HP to my TR it was quite a dramatic change and it is to the credit of CC that I was able to get the chair as close as I did. The small changes I have made this time has really dialed my chair in much better for me. My only concern now is that my shoulders and elbows hold out to keep on pushing, as I am having issues with them.

                  I removed the ADI brakes as they are not a good match for Spinergy wheels, something Todd @ ADI says he is putting a web page together about. The new composite brakes from TiLite are awesome.

                  I don't even think twice about the 85 degree front instead of the 80 I had, it just seems natural; I believe because I had my feet pulled back on my old chair.
                  I also like the narrower front, I do not spend time moving my feet around like I did before.

                  I like the narrowed in sub-frame of the TR3 as when I look down I see less chair and even in pictures it looks cleaner. I'll also note that I really like the polished frame, my old chair looks so dull now, but that could be chalked up to "something different" at this point.
                  C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

                  Comment


                    #54
                    Originally posted by Brianm View Post
                    The new composite brakes from TiLite are awesome.
                    These wheel locks are better than I expected on my new TR. I wanted to hate them but I don't. I was used to the under the chair type aluminum scissors. Because of their location I bump them off or on occasionally, and they do look rather flimsy to me. We'll see how well they hold up.

                    http://www.out-front.com/oflock_overview.php

                    Comment


                      #55
                      Originally posted by Brianm View Post
                      I have been using the chair full time for about a week now and I am very happy to report back how pleased I am with this chair, I only wish I had a setup like this 20+ years ago, I believe my arms and shoulders would be in a lot better shape today.

                      Going with 25" wheels instead of 24" has made a big improvement for me in my reach for the wheels, it can't be emphasized enough how much difference this has made. I would also like to note that for my custom hand-rims, instead of simply making them 1" bigger in diameter for the 1" bigger wheel compared to my other chair, I made them another 3/4" inch bigger in diameter, pushing the projections further out, therefore closer in reach. ... My only concern now is that my shoulders and elbows hold out to keep on pushing, as I am having issues with them. ...
                      Very interesting update, particularly expanding the OD of your custom rims to better position the projections for pushing. So are you saying the new, closer rim orientation necessitates a more strained, gull-wing-ish stroke to clear the projections – even tho, according to the CADS, the new chair is about 1.5" narrower than the old one? Just curious, I might be in the same boat down the line a ways.

                      Also, is that your vehicle tie-down frame mounted to the TR3 undercarriage?

                      Comment


                        #56
                        Didn't I see a McIntosh on the rack behind you in previous pictures? Upgrade? To what?



                        Comment


                          #57
                          nofuss--What I am saying on the hand-rims, is that the actual end of the projections come closer to the limits of the tire, therefore closer to my reach. The tubing is still 3/4" as before. See pictures.

                          Yes, that is my tie-down.

                          (Anyone know why an attached picture, using manage attachments, sometimes displays and other times is a clickable link?)
                          C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

                          Comment


                            #58
                            Originally posted by brian View Post
                            Didn't I see a McIntosh on the rack behind you in previous pictures? Upgrade? To what?
                            Indeed you did. I replaced the McIntosh with a Luxman L590A II integrated, almost 3 years ago already.
                            C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

                            Comment


                              #59
                              Originally posted by Brianm View Post
                              I removed the ADI brakes as they are not a good match for Spinergy wheels, something Todd @ ADI says he is putting a web page together about. The new composite brakes from TiLite are awesome.
                              Were the ADI brakes difficult to remove, I mean specifically the spline drive? That has been one of my concerns in case we do not like them.

                              Are you considering D's or Surelocks instead?

                              Any hint about the match with Spinergy wheels? I've been on the wall about ordering them, and need to make a decision soon (you can always PM me if you are more comfortable with that).
                              Partner of an incredible stroke survivor. Limitations: hemiparesis and neglect (functional paralysis and complete lack of awareness on one side). Equipment: TiLite ZRA 2 and 2GX, Spinergy ZX-1, RioMobility Firefly. Knowledge: relative newbie for high-level equipment (2012), but willing to try to help others who are new with similar limitations (definitely not a guru, but inquisitive).

                              Comment


                                #60
                                The brake system was very easy to remove. I haven't removed the spline in my hub yet; I tried meeting up with my brother this past weekend to do so but was never able too.

                                I am not considering any other brakes, these composite brakes are wonderful, thus far.

                                I think it was Tooley that hit on the issue a few pages back, about the flex in the spokes. Here is a note from ADI:

                                In order to easily remove the wheel from the disc hub, we have designed a minimal amount of play between the mating components. The balance of the movement is coming from the play or flex in the wheel spokes. If you watch the movement closely, you'll notice the disc hubs are stationary “locked in place”, but the "rock" occurs because of the flex of the spokes.

                                The Spinergy wheel is robust and lightweight, but the flexible nature of the PBO fiber spoke is not so great when used with either the ADI disc brake or other wheel locks that lock the wheel at the hub. The amount of rock / movement in the Spinergy wheel is one of the reasons why we developed the Fusion16 DB wheel. The Fusion16 has 12 gauge steel spokes with minimal spoke flex. FYI - the Spinergy 18 spoke has less flex than the 12 spoke LX.
                                C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

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