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Few Questions about buying a Tilite TR

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  • Few Questions about buying a Tilite TR

    Do tilite have adjustable angle backrests on their chairs as an option? I seem to remember they had this option a few years ago or maybe just a false memory...

    And by the explaination on their order forms you have to calculate the dump of the seat to determine the backrest angle... That being said, If my new chair has 5" dump... the order form looks like I should have a backrest angle of 80 degrees.

    I'm pretty sure I'm reading too much into this coz my innitial thought was that the amount of dump was irrelevant all you needed to know was how far you wanted to lean forward or backward... What's your thoughts?

    If i want to get the ride designs (or another 3rd party backrest in the future) is there anything I need to be wary of... I've looked briefly into it, so I'm not too sure which backrest I will get in the future...

    That's it for now, I'm sure more questions will present themselves as I delved deeper into this order form...

    Thanks in advance.
    Everybody wants freedom.... They just don't want it for everybody else...

    A college professor, a man I now consider my dad, once told me...
    "The minute you let someone decide what you can and cannot do, your life is no longer yours." A truer word has never been spoken in my opinion.


    Professor Bill Johnston
    (1930- )

  • #2
    As I understand it, tilite has adjustable angle backs that are adjustable with tools. The kind that you would set and leave. I'd imagine that as long as the angle you put on the order form is in the ballpark, you're going to have the exact angle set once you're in the chair and then might change it up slightly as you use the chair.

    Quickie has a different kind of adjustable back angle, with a piston locking type design to select different options on the go/in the chair. The back angle was my biggest concern with my chair, the only types I found were those and then adjustability offered with the hardware of specific hard backs.
    Board Member of Assistance Dog Advocacy Project working in Education. Feel free to ask me any service dog questions!

    I am not paralyzed. I have a genetic connective tissue disorder with neuro complications and a movement disorder.

    Comment


    • #3
      You are right -- you can adjust the back angle on TRs -- there's a multi drilled and tapped plate that allows the back frame to pivot to the main. 5" of dump is alot -- are you sure you need that much? -- I have the TR, great underrated chair; you won't be disappointed.

      Comment


      • #4
        If you order an adjustable back, the angle you select on the form is just where they will set it for you at the factory, you can readjust it to the other settings you see on the form yourself. Don't think you are stuck with the setting you select.

        Dump and back angle are two separate things when ordering, you do not have to consider one when figuring the other.

        You cannot adjust the dump on a TR, what you order is what it will be. Other chairs, like the ZR's, Aero Z, etc., you can adjust your rear seat height (RSH).
        C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Brianm View Post
          You cannot adjust the dump on a TR, what you order is what it will be. Other chairs, like the ZR's, Aero Z, etc., you can adjust your rear seat height (RSH).
          Minor clarification that I know Brianm is well aware of. The dump can be adjusted on a ZRA, but not the ZR. The latter has a fixed rear STF height.

          Also keep in mind that even with an adjustable version of any of these models, changing the STF heights will also change the effective front frame angle of the chair (See attachment for an example). Therefore, you want to have a good idea how much dump you want before you pull the trigger and order the chair. CAD drawings are always a good idea.

          Comment


          • #6
            Good catch SCI_OTR.
            C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

            Comment


            • #7
              Sorry or the late reply...

              5" inch was just an example to make the point easier to understand... Although I have a chair with 2" of dump and it feels like nothing... I don't trust going down inclines
              without lifting the front wheels off the ground... Not that its a regular occurance but I have been carried down a flight of stairs and had to hang on for dear life for fear
              of falling out...

              If I were to have a lot of dump in my chair I would most likely have to shorten the seat depth... Correct?

              SCI_OTR I saw the tight Top End wheelchair you spec'ed, that just looked like it was all wheel and no frame... That's what I am looking to achieve although I'm not sure what are the ramifications... I know a poorly setup wheelchair can cause all sorts of problems... The chair I have now for some reason causes serious shoulder ache... not sure what design of the chair causes this. I'm pretty sure it's the chair doing this as the ache disappears as soon as i transfer to the bed for instance... What's your thoughts?
              Last edited by Mutley; 04-08-2012, 08:22 PM.
              Everybody wants freedom.... They just don't want it for everybody else...

              A college professor, a man I now consider my dad, once told me...
              "The minute you let someone decide what you can and cannot do, your life is no longer yours." A truer word has never been spoken in my opinion.


              Professor Bill Johnston
              (1930- )

              Comment


              • #8
                I had another thought about CoG... I have no clue as to how much I need and I've seen some TR's with a bar that's parallel to the ground. I wouldn't mind this as an option so I could tweak the CoG to get it right... How would I go about specifying that as a requirement? I'm meeting up with a OT to help spec out this chair but I dont hold much hope on their ability.
                Everybody wants freedom.... They just don't want it for everybody else...

                A college professor, a man I now consider my dad, once told me...
                "The minute you let someone decide what you can and cannot do, your life is no longer yours." A truer word has never been spoken in my opinion.


                Professor Bill Johnston
                (1930- )

                Comment


                • #9
                  I believe all TR's are built with the lower bar parallel to the ground (ignore non-TR pics). If they weren't, adjusting the CoG would change the rear STF height.

                  Whether or not the frame is square (i.e., larger CoG adjustment range) depends on several factors (from page 8 of the TR YR order form):
                  Last edited by chasmengr; 04-09-2012, 09:20 AM.
                  Chas
                  TiLite TR3
                  Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
                  I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

                  "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
                  <
                  UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Mutley View Post
                    I had another thought about CoG... I have no clue as to how much I need and I've seen some TR's with a bar that's parallel to the ground. I wouldn't mind this as an option so I could tweak the CoG to get it right... How would I go about specifying that as a requirement? I'm meeting up with a OT to help spec out this chair but I dont hold much hope on their ability.
                    The COG is adjustable on the TR. You are aware that the TR is a box style frame and all have this ability, yes? See mine at the link below with CAD drawings, Post #4.
                    /forum/showthread.php?t=153343
                    C5-6 Complete - 8/13/1982

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thanks BrianM & Chasmengr... I 've seen very few TR's in and around where I live. Maybe it was an optical illusion, but I'd always thought the bottom bar had a slight tilt towards the foot plate... Another question - Is there a formular to figure out the change in R STF height, if you changed the camber of the wheels?
                      Everybody wants freedom.... They just don't want it for everybody else...

                      A college professor, a man I now consider my dad, once told me...
                      "The minute you let someone decide what you can and cannot do, your life is no longer yours." A truer word has never been spoken in my opinion.


                      Professor Bill Johnston
                      (1930- )

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Mutley View Post
                        Another question - Is there a formular to figure out the change in R STF height, if you changed the camber of the wheels?
                        Yes there is, but changing the camber won't change the vertical distance from your shoulder to the wheel's axles, which is typically changes when you change the R STF height. (In other words, when you change camber, the axle height and seat height both change together.)

                        Do you still want the formula? If so, I'll post it for you (it's trigonometry).
                        Chas
                        TiLite TR3
                        Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
                        I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

                        "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
                        <
                        UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          That'd be awesome... I'm concerned about how the chair will behave I do change the camber... I'm thinking about using the chair for tennis so having a second camber option is ideal (I think). Changing the camber of the rear wheels will mess with the geometry of the front caster axles - in turn inhibiting their turning ability.
                          Last edited by Mutley; 04-09-2012, 08:58 PM.
                          Everybody wants freedom.... They just don't want it for everybody else...

                          A college professor, a man I now consider my dad, once told me...
                          "The minute you let someone decide what you can and cannot do, your life is no longer yours." A truer word has never been spoken in my opinion.


                          Professor Bill Johnston
                          (1930- )

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Based on this pic (in which camber ~22 degrees for clarity), several formulas exist:


                            Variables:
                            c = camber
                            D = actual wheel diameter
                            Ho = axle height at 0-degrees camber
                            Hc = axle height at "c" camber
                            dH = change in height (axle and RSH)
                            Wc = center-line wheel width at "c" camber (W at 0 camber = 0)

                            Formulas:
                            Ho = D/2
                            Hc = D*cos(c)/2
                            dH = Ho-Hc
                            Wc = D*sin(c)

                            example one:
                            c=2; D=24.5"
                            Ho =12.25"
                            Hc = 12.24"
                            dH = 0.01"
                            Wc = 0.9"

                            example two:
                            c=18; D=620 mm
                            Ho = 310 mm
                            Hc = 295 mm
                            dH = 15 mm
                            Wc = 191 mm

                            As you can see, camber has just a little effect on seat height; it has more effect on chair width.

                            If you have any questions please ask.

                            (For the math inclined, please check my work, and comment where necessary.)
                            Last edited by chasmengr; 04-10-2012, 09:25 AM.
                            Chas
                            TiLite TR3
                            Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
                            I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

                            "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
                            <
                            UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              and a tabulation of some various values:

                              Chas
                              TiLite TR3
                              Dual-Axle TR3 with RioMobility DragonFly
                              I am a person with mild/moderate hexaparesis (impaired movement in 4 limbs, head, & torso) caused by RRMS w/TM C7&T7 incomplete.

                              "I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but what I don't think you realize is that what you heard is not what I meant."
                              <
                              UNKNOWN AUTHOR>

                              Comment

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