Stephen Davies Update

[Chaz19]

I'm glad that this thread is no longer sticky. Schmecky–thank you for your initial lab visits and report.

Many of us here donated money to Dr. Davies and then were scorned for asking questions. No patient should be scorned for asking questions in my opinion. Especially, when the research doesn't pan out and you donate with the intention of receiving some feedback whether it is positive or negative.

I think it is an issue of respect for the community and the lack of communication is disappointing because it further distances patients from researchers.

[Charles Hansen]

Especially, when the research doesn't pan out and you donate with the intention of receiving some feedback whether it is positive or negative.

Can somebody help me out here? I'm kind of like Rip Van Winkle. I had a bad bout of food poisoning that almost killed me and I was in the hospital for seven months, most of it unconscious, sedated, or in a coma. When I went in, there were grumblings that Dr. Davies wasn't doing enough to communicate with the people on this forum.

But now everyone talks as though Dr. Davies' theories have been thoroughly discredited, his research has been proven to use falsified data, and on and on. I don't have time to go back through seven months of posts, so maybe somebody would be kind enough to fill me in on why the big shift in attitude towards Dr. Davies. The last I knew, we were waiting for his next paper...

Thanks!

[pman2012]

This is possibly one of the most interesting threads to skim through from start to finish,
I think it highlights the strong passion of finding a cure, the sadness when it doesnt come to fruition. It is uncanny how many times I ahve heard the 5 year cure answer, i dont believe this is malicious just maybe an overestimation by some researchers.
I think Wise and Davies are probably both good people, but I think Wise goes the extra mile. I have an idea that a cure or a treatment for spinal cord injury would also be able to work on patients with so called sciatica(Broad term really), and there are millions of sufferers with sciatica, and it would be a very lucrative investment for the big pharma companies, so maybe if we could make it well known that acure owuld help all th epople on here with SCI and and people with sciatica woudl not then more companies get involved? any ideas?

[GRAMMY]

Can somebody help me out here? The last I knew, we were waiting for his next paper...
Thanks!

Charlie, make a 5 minute phone call up to Mark Noble at the University of Rochester and ask him for his honest opinion of the decorin studies if you're seriously interested.

[khmorgan]

Charlie, make a 5 minute phone call up to Mark Noble at the University of Rochester and ask him for his honest opinion of the decorin studies if you're seriously interested.

Rather than lots of people calling Dr. Noble, perhaps reading his research overview will suffice: http://www.urmc.rochester.edu/biomed.../noble-lab.cfm

Note: he co-authored several papers with both of the Davies, so that might give you a hint.

[Jim]

fill me in on why the big shift in attitude towards Dr. Davies. The last I knew, we were waiting for his next paper...

Thanks!

As Chaz said, Dr. Davies came on this website, raised a lot of money, then disappeared. This doesn't mean his research isn't continuing to show promise, but to raise money here then never come back is kinda shifty. But, he may be in contact personally with his donors and that would be completely acceptable.

[6 Shooter]

Rather than lots of people calling Dr. Noble, perhaps reading his research overview will suffice: http://www.urmc.rochester.edu/biomed.../noble-lab.cfm

Note: he co-authored several papers with both of the Davies, so that might give you a hint.

http://www.plosone.org/article/info%...l.pone.0017328

One of the listed papers dated in 2011

[GRAMMY]

I didn't suggest lots of people to call Mark, nor review the Noble Lab acute injury astrocyte work. The point I made was for Charlie to visit with Mark about the decorin studies.

[khmorgan]

I didn't suggest lots of people to call Mark, nor review the Noble Lab acute injury astrocyte work. The point I made was for Charlie to visit with Mark about the decorin studies.

Sorry, I assumed that Charlie was not the only reader of this forum who was interested in the current research opinions on Decorin. Perhaps I was wrong.

[Wise Young]

Here is a 2012 paper published by Stephen Davies

1. Minor K, Jasper K, Davies JE and Davies S (2012). 196 Intrathecal Infusion of Decorin to Sub-acute Contusion Spinal Cord Injury Promotes Robust Functional Recovery. Neurosurgery 71: E576. INTRODUCTION: : Decorin is a small leucine-rich repeat protein found in many tissues throughout the body that has been shown to have anti-inflammatory and anti-fibrotic properties. Direct infusion of decorin into rodent cerebral cortex or spinal cord injuries can suppress fibrotic scarring and the expression of multiple axons growth inhibitory chondroitin sulphate proteoglycans (CSPGs) and semaphorin 3A(1-3). In addition, decorin has also been shown to 'desensitize' neurons to the inhibitory effects of both CSPGs and myelin associated molecules4 in vitro. To further explore the therapeutic potential of decorin in treating CNS injuries, we tested the ability of decorin to promote recovery in a clinically relevant sub-acute (12 days post injury) rodent cervical spinal cord contusion injury model. METHODS: : Unilateral contusion injuries were carried out on adult Sprague-Dawley rats at the C4/C5 spinal level. At 12 days after injury, animals were split into three groups. The decorin treatment group received an intrathecal infusion of human recombinant decorin core protein in saline over a period of 7 days. The remaining control spinal cord injured rats received either intrathecal infusion of saline vehicle or a catheter and no treatment. Functional recovery was assessed at time points ranging from 1 to 7 weeks post treatment with horizontal ladder and CatWalk gait analyses. RESULTS: : Robust functional recovery was observed in decorin treated rats in both tests compared to control spinal cord injured rats that failed to show significant improvements. Histological analysis of decorin treated cords revealed robust increases in corticospinal tract collaterals and synaptic plasticity within spinal gray matter below sites of injury compared to controls. CONCLUSION: : Our results demonstrate that intrathecal infusion of decorin at a clinically relevant time point of twelve days post injury can promote functional recovery and provide further support for the development of decorin as a therapy for the injured human spinal cord.

[GRAMMY]

Thanks Wise, 12 day post recovery from anti-inflammatory response. Definately not clinically relevant to chronics. I think most of the community donating money many years ago were told the chronic studies were underway and expected some feedback one way or the other on those studies. The acute results were posted here July 17, 2006. After an additional 6 years of study, I guess 12 days (sub-acute) post injury is the best Decorin will ever do. He reported on 8 day post at W2W 2011 breakouts. A gain of 4 days and still no BBB score. Not a blockbuster paper in neurosurgery if anyone was waiting for that...

[Charles Hansen]

Wow, tough crowd!

First Davies was criticized for not using contusion injuries. Then he was criticized for only performing acute studies.

Then he just released a paper (August 2012, Neurosurgery) using contusion injuries that are not acute. and he gets criticized because the injuries weren't old enough. Some days you just can't win.

Every paper he has released has shown excellent recovery. He is methodically progressing step-by-step, and all he gets is criticism. My guess would be that he performed an informal test and got dramatic results and didn't want to wait a year to inform people of the results, instead publishing an intermediate study of 12 days. But I can't read his mind. You would have to ask him.

As far as BBB scores, he has told me in the past that they are not nearly useful as the grid-walk he uses. He said that the BBB score simply showed that the animal could move the affected limbs again, while the grid-walk required volitional foot placement at a specific location. This is a much more stringent tests and shows that the animal can not only move the limb but has full control over it and can place it accurately when walking again.

[GRAMMY]

My guess would be that he performed an informal test and got dramatic results and didn't want to wait a year to inform people of the results, instead publishing an intermediate study of 12 days.

Realistically, if he had "dramatic results" with Decorin you can bet your last dollar he would have rushed to publish it in a top notch journal like Nature or Science immediately rather than fooling around showing an increase of 4 extra days anti-inflammation study in neurosurgery after 6 years time. (You had pointed out a couple months ago that he was paranoid about someone taking his research ideas, remember?)...

As far as BBB scores, he has told me in the past that they are not nearly useful as the grid-walk he uses. He said that the BBB score simply showed that the animal could move the affected limbs again, while the grid-walk required volitional foot placement at a specific location.

A gridwalk test is used to just pick up small differences in footfalls. The 21 point BBB scores are very important and I think most sci researchers will confirm that when attempts are being made to develop a sci therapy.

Just my opinion of course...

[NWC4]

Tough crowd? We have been waiting 6 years for Davies to move toward human clinical trials. I would say most have been quite passive. At this point are we really expected to be excited by another method/means of inducing injured rats to walk? Sub-acute rats at that!?

[Charles Hansen]

Tough crowd? We have been waiting 6 years for Davies to move toward human clinical trials. I would say most have been quite passive. At this point are we really expected to be excited by another method/means of inducing injured rats to walk? Sub-acute rats at that!?

Not to be flip, but what are you excited about? What research is being done with results that you feel are exciting?

Thanks.