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More good news out of UCLA lab on restoring bladder function non-invasive after SCI

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    More good news out of UCLA lab on restoring bladder function non-invasive after SCI

    A non-invasive method to restore bladder function after a spinal cord injury continues to show progress in the Dr. Daniel Lu laboratory at UCLA. This experiment showed positive results in 5 people eliminating the need for catheters for up to 4 weeks. (cp)



    https://spinalcordresearchandadvocacy.wordpress.com/

    thanks Grammy

    #2
    Hard not to want to say 10 more years and 3 more papers and something might come out to help us. Hope I am wrong. Good it’s noninvasive and existing technology.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Lyerly View Post
      Hard not to want to say 10 more years and 3 more papers and something might come out to help us. Hope I am wrong. Good it’s noninvasive and existing technology.
      A study of this technology with 5 people is a long way from becoming mainstream effective and available. Don't hold your breath.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Lyerly View Post
        Hard not to want to say 10 more years and 3 more papers and something might come out to help us. Hope I am wrong. Good it?s noninvasive and existing technology.
        Did you read the paper link called "A Proof-of-Concept Study of Transcutaneous Magnetic Spinal Cord Stimulation for Neurogenic Bladder?" This tiny proof study was just 5 people and was an IRB at the University. They are not hardly even started on finding out what all needs to be known and proven in order to have everyone using it in the clinic. They need to have some results and studies in a lot more people. More time and more study results are needed for sure. No clinical doctor will administer a proof of concept theory on one of their patients. One must enroll in the clinical trial for testing and experimentation like these 5 guys did. Nobody knows how long it will take to become mainstream medical protocol. This is very basic early laboratory research, it is promising, but not anywhere close to complete. In reality, it's taking a very small number of people and working on a hunch that TMSCS might work. I hope people understand that the concept is barely preliminary stage with just 5 people in this "IRB". It's not a therapy on the market, nor is it close to being such.

        https://www.fda.gov/forpatients/clin...al/default.htm

        Last edited by GRAMMY; 27 Aug 2018, 12:33 PM.
        http://spinalcordresearchandadvocacy.wordpress.com/

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          #5
          The coolest part is that the equipment they used is commonplace in hospitals all over the country so I would imagine some "off label" use on the near horizon.
          T3 complete since Sept 2015.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by GRAMMY View Post
            Did you read the paper link called "A Proof-of-Concept Study of Transcutaneous Magnetic Spinal Cord Stimulation for Neurogenic Bladder?" This tiny proof study was just 5 people and was an IRB at the University. They are not hardly even started on finding out what all needs to be known and proven in order to have everyone using it in the clinic. They need to have some results and studies in a lot more people. More time and more study results are needed for sure. No clinical doctor will administer a proof of concept theory on one of their patients. One must enroll in the clinical trial for testing and experimentation like these 5 guys did. Nobody knows how long it will take to become mainstream medical protocol. This is very basic early laboratory research, it is promising, but not anywhere close to complete. In reality, it's taking a very small number of people and working on a hunch that TMSCS might work. I hope people understand that the concept is barely preliminary stage with just 5 people in this "IRB". It's not a therapy on the market, nor is it close to being such.

            https://www.fda.gov/forpatients/clin...al/default.htm

            I am not an expert but do have decent knowledge of how things work. Know that this and some of the other studies or research is a long ways away from being in clinic and that continues to be VERY frustrating. Eventually something will get there but the timelines are rarely clear and often moving, not in a good direction. As of Dec I am 10 years and some days it seems like it just happened and other days it seems forever ago. I was naive but never would have imagined 10 years after injury it’s still so far away. I’m not talking about a cure but functional improving treatment.

            I thought things like the epidural implant were closest and easiest being based off of existing technology. First participant was implanted 10 years ago and they have only done 12-15 total. Likely need hundreds to prove effectiveness. That’s going to take years. I won’t waste time guessing but it’s a ways off.

            Comment


              #7
              There are way way more than 12-16 with implanted electrodes. I think we've heard little as my anecdotal evaluation indicates poor results are the norm.
              T3 complete since Sept 2015.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Mize View Post
                There are way way more than 12-16 with implanted electrodes. I think we've heard little as my anecdotal evaluation indicates poor results are the norm.
                I guess I should clarify that is what I am hearing out of Louisville, KY and under Dr. Harkema. Not sure about Mayo and a few others.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Mize View Post
                  The coolest part is that the equipment they used is commonplace in hospitals all over the country so I would imagine some "off label" use on the near horizon.
                  Mize, do you know more about the electromagnetic device they are using ?..
                  Brand and where to buy ?..
                  I'm out of inclusion criteria, my physio is ok to begin therapy right away..
                  Thanks

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by George78 View Post
                    Do you know more about the electromagnetic device they are using ?..
                    From https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-018-30232-z

                    it says they used
                    A MagVenture Magnetic Stimulator (MagPro R30, Atlanta, GA) with an active/placebo figure-8 research coil (Cool-B65 A/P Coil) was used for all transcutaneous magnetic stimulation sessions.
                    You can find a distributor on their web site https://www.magventure.com/find-distributor

                    Looks like the price is about $22k (based on import duty values)

                    Comment


                      #11
                      The results from this study really peaked my interest, but the paper only talks about volitional urination and just talks about an improvement in SHIM score for sexual function.

                      I asked Dr Lu about this, and if the subjects received any sensation for either functions.
                      To my amazement he told me that they did. They could tell when their bladder was full and were not only getting voluntary erections - their sensation improved.

                      To me improvements in sensation is far more important than the motor aspects of both of these.

                      He is planning on doing a phase 2 trial with a larger amount of subjects and to fine tune the stimulation parameters.

                      Fingers crossed that this could really be something for once.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by George78 View Post
                        Mize, do you know more about the electromagnetic device they are using ?..
                        Brand and where to buy ?..
                        I'm out of inclusion criteria, my physio is ok to begin therapy right away..
                        Thanks
                        Sorry. I've been avoiding CareCure owing to all the political BS. Glad to see Niallel got the answer...$22k is less than a good, new power chair...
                        T3 complete since Sept 2015.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          They have received a large amount of funding for the next stages of testing magnetic stimulation. Hopefully this will go somewhere as a company has been setup to bring it to market as well.

                          http://newsroom.ucla.edu/releases/uc...-cord-injuries

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Anyone want to chip in and buy the machine?

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Are these both women and men test subjects? Sorry, just curious.
                              Roses are red. Tacos are enjoyable. Don't blame immigrants, because you're unemployable.

                              T-11 Flaccid Paraplegic due to TM July 1985 @ age 12

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