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    Jim when you are giving any updates about lumbosacral studies?

  • #2
    Originally posted by Jawaid View Post
    Jim when you are giving any updates about lumbosacral studies?
    Not saying LMN injury treatments will never happen but the more I learn the more see how slowly this stuff moves and unfortunately for you and me, LMN is at the bottom of the priority list. The treatment from Wise and even the epidural stimulation stuff has not been used on LMN injuries. Which I don't always understand, more for the implant than umbilical cord stem cell injections. Madly frustrating.

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    • #3
      For the past 3/4 years lumbosacral injury research has been a top priority at our lab. Wise wrote the following several years ago, much has been learned since.


      The lumbosacral spinal cord is located at T11-L1. It contains the neurons (gray matter) that innervate the muscles of the leg. Damage to the lumbosacral cord results in loss of gray matter including the neurons responsible for innervating muscle and the circuitry for reflexes and programmed movements. When you have flaccid paralysis, you don't have spasticity.

      I believe that restoring function to lumbosacral injuries will require neuronal replacement. Neural stem cells can make neurons and some animal studies suggest that they can also replace motoneurons. There are several sources of immune-compatible neural stem cells. One is induced pluripotent stem (iPS) which can be differentiated to neural stem cells. The other is autologous call pluripotent adult stem cells which can be differentiated into neural stem cells, including the MUSE cells described by Mari Dezawa.

      Please note, however, that much research still needs to be done to find out the best kind of cells to transplant to replace motoneurons, to get these cells to send axons out of the spinal cord to innervate muscle, to regenerate sensory and descending axons to connect with these neurons to reform reflex circuits, and to program the spinal cord for micturition (urination), bowel movements, walking, and other programmed motor function.

      People who have injuries to L2 or lower segments will have primarily spinal root (cauda equina) injuries. These roots need to be regenerated. Axons must be coaxed to grow into the spinal cord. Motor axons must be grown from the spinal cord into the muscle. If the injury is close to the spinal cord, motoneuronal replacement may be necessary.

      Finally, flaccidity (complete loss of muscle tone) usually results in marked atrophy of muscles. For a long time, clinicians thought that denervated muscles could not be restored. However, a group in Vienna has reported that very intense electrical stimulation of muscle can not only maintain but restore denervated muscles.

      I know that the reversal of flaccid paralysis sounds daunting but I think that we will be surprised by how flexible the spinal cord is.

      Wise
      Last edited by Jim; 07-09-2017, 04:40 PM.

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      • #4
        Wise--Good to read your voice again. Please keep up the good work as so many are counting on your progress.

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        • #5
          Wide pulse estim is in a lab now .. will come back later. Have to remember where I saw it.

          Harkema's lab was working on software too.
          Roses are red. Tacos are enjoyable. Don't blame immigrants, because you're unemployable.

          T-11 Flaccid Paraplegic due to TM July 1985 @ age 12

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          • #6
            Randolph Ashton is a researcher who is doing a lot of work in replacing motor neurons lost due to spinal cord injury as well as other diseases/conditions.
            https://directory.engr.wisc.edu/disp...shton_randolph

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            • #7
              Originally posted by lynnifer View Post
              Wide pulse estim is in a lab now .. will come back later. Have to remember where I saw it.

              Harkema's lab was working on software too.
              Wide pulse estim? Where can I find more info on that?

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              • #8
                Paragraph 7

                http://keck.rutgers.edu/research-cli...linical-trials
                "That's not smog! It's SMUG!! " - randy marsh, southpark

                "what???? , you don't 'all' wear a poop sac?.... DAMNIT BONNIE, YOU LIED TO ME ABOUT THE POOP SAC!!!! "


                2010 SCINet Clinical Trial Support Squad Member
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                • #9
                  It's really just RTI units very similar to the RTI FES bike. The unit is called Excite and the pulse width is as high as 3000 and the current FDA approved amount is 500. From what I understand the belief is that the higher pulse width allows the current to get deeper down and excite the muscle and cord itself which can lead to functional gains. The gains have been small and in small increments but it's something.

                  Especialky wjth the current resulting in visible contractions for many ,LMN injuries. They have been using it in clinic for at least 2 years now and the FDA has approved the device but not the settings. I have no clue why something noninvasive takes so long that people have done on a daily basis for months with no problems.

                  People can get months of the stim at some clinics but if your gains don't fit the insurance definition of functional gains they will shut you down by not paying. So can't continue at home to see if it leads to further progress or even maintaining the gains.

                  One of the many examples out there that make you get jaded. External non invasive treatment that has been done for years in clinic with limited issues STILL isn't ready for us.

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                  • #10
                    Thanks for the post Jim.

                    Can you expand on the part in bold?


                    Originally posted by Jim View Post
                    For the past 3/4 years lumbosacral injury research has been a top priority at our lab. Wise wrote the following several years ago, much has been learned since.


                    The lumbosacral spinal cord is located at T11-L1. It contains the neurons (gray matter) that innervate the muscles of the leg. Damage to the lumbosacral cord results in loss of gray matter including the neurons responsible for innervating muscle and the circuitry for reflexes and programmed movements. When you have flaccid paralysis, you don't have spasticity.

                    I believe that restoring function to lumbosacral injuries will require neuronal replacement. Neural stem cells can make neurons and some animal studies suggest that they can also replace motoneurons. There are several sources of immune-compatible neural stem cells. One is induced pluripotent stem (iPS) which can be differentiated to neural stem cells. The other is autologous call pluripotent adult stem cells which can be differentiated into neural stem cells, including the MUSE cells described by Mari Dezawa.

                    Please note, however, that much research still needs to be done to find out the best kind of cells to transplant to replace motoneurons, to get these cells to send axons out of the spinal cord to innervate muscle, to regenerate sensory and descending axons to connect with these neurons to reform reflex circuits, and to program the spinal cord for micturition (urination), bowel movements, walking, and other programmed motor function.

                    People who have injuries to L2 or lower segments will have primarily spinal root (cauda equina) injuries. These roots need to be regenerated. Axons must be coaxed to grow into the spinal cord. Motor axons must be grown from the spinal cord into the muscle. If the injury is close to the spinal cord, motoneuronal replacement may be necessary.

                    Finally, flaccidity (complete loss of muscle tone) usually results in marked atrophy of muscles. For a long time, clinicians thought that denervated muscles could not be restored. However, a group in Vienna has reported that very intense electrical stimulation of muscle can not only maintain but restore denervated muscles.

                    I know that the reversal of flaccid paralysis sounds daunting but I think that we will be surprised by how flexible the spinal cord is.

                    Wise

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                    • #11
                      Jim?

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by scisucks View Post
                        Jim?
                        Please note the information posted elsewhere on our forums about the recent tragic death in Jim's family. He will not be on our forums for a while.

                        (KLD)
                        The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

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                        • #13
                          https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/...+injury&rank=1

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                          • #14
                            Like every trial it is excluding injury levels below T10. Wise has stated that 20% of SCI have low level damage and other than the work Jim says they are doing, it is pretty much ignored.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by SCI-Nurse View Post
                              Please note the information posted elsewhere on our forums about the recent tragic death in Jim's family. He will not be on our forums for a while.

                              (KLD)
                              I apologise - I didn't know.

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