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    Is sensation return possible?

    A recent study I read believes that sensory spinal cord nerves grow UP from the periphery nerves to the brain and motor nerves grow down. This would mean that we'd have little to no hope of reconnecting sensory neurons to their original docking points even if nerves are able to breach the lesion.

    Am I also to think that it's possible that motor neurons could grow multiple feet through the spinal cord tissue below the lesion and find their original docking points? How is that even conceivable?

    #2
    I have heard that in the case of TBI, strokes, etc there can be a rerouting of some nerve pathways to get sensation and motor function back. I'm not sure whether the rerouting occours in the brain or further along the nerve path.

    It was explained that when the brain couldn't connect things through the old pathways it rerouted commands through different ones (with a lot of time and hard work)

    Don't know if that would address your question but it seems to say that as long as some connection is present through damaged zone, the brain doesent need the exact pathways.

    Maybe someone else who understands this concept better can explain. I have a complete injury and have never worked with a therapist on the rerouting idea.

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      #3
      Can you post this study? I have never heard of either happening in humans, or any mammal in fact.

      Originally posted by rioderbi View Post
      A recent study I read believes that sensory spinal cord nerves grow UP from the periphery nerves to the brain and motor nerves grow down. This would mean that we'd have little to no hope of reconnecting sensory neurons to their original docking points even if nerves are able to breach the lesion.

      Am I also to think that it's possible that motor neurons could grow multiple feet through the spinal cord tissue below the lesion and find their original docking points? How is that even conceivable?

      Comment


        #4
        Getting regrown motor neurons to not only grow through the damaged cord area, but then to hook up to the correct target lower motor neuron inches or even feet down the cord are both two of the main dilemmas facing CNS regeneration researchers. I am sure Dr. Young can explain these issues better than I can though.

        (KLD)
        The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

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          #5
          I remember asking that question a few years ago, and that was when I realized just how f’ed I really am. I will never go back to the way I was. I think a mechanical cure is more feasible. Every sensation you have is in the brain and still there. Electrical/optical brain stimulation can trigger those sensations. In the future of course. Hopefully, that technology can move a fast pace. It will be here before they get sensory axons to grow all the way up to the brain and then to their proper targets (if ever)!

          http://sciencelife.uchospitals.edu/2...osthetic-hand/

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            #6
            What if eyes are closed to stop that input to brain? Also is there any information regarding input to brain, but at incorrect time/speed? Essentially, brain knew how to do all of this from time we were born or even earlier. It ALSO knew how to control these things as we grew. INTANTLY, with injury, brain and eyes still know/knew how to do all of this. We never had "practice" with some parts broke.

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              #7
              We recently completed enrollment in our Phase I/II spinal cord injury trial, which represents the world's first test of human neural stem cell transplantation in chronic injury. The interim data from this trial includes evidence of return of function to the spinal cord below the site of the injury. Due to the severity and location of the injuries in these cases, the types and degrees of sensory function gain that we have reported were not expected by experts. The fact that four of the eight patients dosed, to-date, have experienced return of sensation is, in and of itself, very encouraging, but we believe the fact that the regained sensation extends to as many as six segments below the level of injury is suggestive of a fundamental regenerative process occurring in the spinal cord.
              http://online.wsj.com/article/PR-CO-...29-906827.html
              KB

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by rioderbi View Post
                A recent study I read believes that sensory spinal cord nerves grow UP from the periphery nerves to the brain and motor nerves grow down. This would mean that we'd have little to no hope of reconnecting sensory neurons to their original docking points even if nerves are able to breach the lesion.

                Am I also to think that it's possible that motor neurons could grow multiple feet through the spinal cord tissue below the lesion and find their original docking points? How is that even conceivable?
                Sensory nerves going from the periphery up to the brain is half the battle when it comes to neural regeneration. Getting neurons to re-grow and connect to their original targets is also incredibly daunting, as it is

                Originally posted by Nowhere Man View Post
                I remember asking that question a few years ago, and that was when I realized just how f’ed I really am. I will never go back to the way I was. I think a mechanical cure is more feasible. Every sensation you have is in the brain and still there. Electrical/optical brain stimulation can trigger those sensations. In the future of course. Hopefully, that technology can move a fast pace. It will be here before they get sensory axons to grow all the way up to the brain and then to their proper targets (if ever)!

                http://sciencelife.uchospitals.edu/2...osthetic-hand/
                Sensation isn't necessarily "still there" after injury. The motor cortex of the brain re-organizes and re-maps significantly after SCI, when certain nerves and reflexes are never used anymore. Physiologically it makes sense for the sensory system as well, that things may be significantly re-organized.

                This of course, only complicates things then, because even if you get axons (motor or sensory) to grow to their original targets, the signals may not be going to the correct place anyway, due to the re-organization of the brain. Once we find out how to re-connect axons to anywhere, we'll still have to come up with ways to re-organize the CNS so that signals get used properly.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by tomsonite View Post
                  Sensory nerves going from the periphery up to the brain is half the battle when it comes to neural regeneration. Getting neurons to re-grow and connect to their original targets is also incredibly daunting, as it is

                  Sensation isn't necessarily "still there" after injury. The motor cortex of the brain re-organizes and re-maps significantly after SCI, when certain nerves and reflexes are never used anymore. Physiologically it makes sense for the sensory system as well, that things may be significantly re-organized.

                  This of course, only complicates things then, because even if you get axons (motor or sensory) to grow to their original targets, the signals may not be going to the correct place anyway, due to the re-organization of the brain. Once we find out how to re-connect axons to anywhere, we'll still have to come up with ways to re-organize the CNS so that signals get used properly.
                  I don't doubt that the somatosensory cortex reorganizes itself. I was under the impression that the sensory neurons remain in the brain. As long as they are still reachable then I don't care where they are. A brain chip would need to be calibrated on an individual by individual basis anyways.

                  I don't think they would be able to control exactly where axons grow and connect to (in central nervous system) even in a hundred years. However, it is much more feasible to be able to control which neurons you electrically/optically stimulate with a brain chip.

                  Scientists need to learn how to get axons to regenerate first.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    all this seems very unlikely in even 100 years, which is really sad. I need to pin my dreams onto some hope, but I haven't found one.

                    All I did was a mini dolphin dive from the lake bottom and misjudged the angle of entry. Hands were out in front. What the f happened.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by rioderbi View Post
                      A recent study I read believes that sensory spinal cord nerves grow UP from the periphery nerves to the brain and motor nerves grow down. This would mean that we'd have little to no hope of reconnecting sensory neurons to their original docking points even if nerves are able to breach the lesion.

                      Am I also to think that it's possible that motor neurons could grow multiple feet through the spinal cord tissue below the lesion and find their original docking points? How is that even conceivable?
                      I guess the idea is not reconnecting a point to another, but giving the opportunity to the CNS to re-organize itself..

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by George78 View Post
                        I guess the idea is not reconnecting a point to another, but giving the opportunity to the CNS to re-organize itself..
                        Thats exactly it. It will be much easier to just regenerate the nervous system, then let it re-organize through training.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Seriously has a clinical trial ever recorded return in sensation?? Especially I'm terms of sexual function, effects quality-of-life majorly. Do clinical trials ever even collect data on sexual function return? It seems to be treated like a taboo even in professional medical scenarios. The epidural stimulator trial focused more on moving of limps bladder and bowel function, nothing official on sexual function returns. Even though it was apparently achieved, according to patients and a few smaller articles. This is such a major function for people affected with paralysis, mentally, physically, emotionally it's extremely serious.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Are the sensory nerves in a entirely different section of the spinal cord that could have been completely spared? I always understood there was a thing called "auto-destruction" and if your cord was injured bad enough to make you a motor complete chances are it destroyed the sensory nerves.
                            Last edited by Curt Leatherbee; 7 Apr 2015, 8:59 PM.
                            "Life is about how you
                            respond to not only the
                            challenges you're dealt but
                            the challenges you seek...If
                            you have no goals, no
                            mountains to climb, your
                            soul dies".~Liz Fordred

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                              #15
                              I truly believe there will be major scientific advances in SCI research, especially for sensation.

                              I am Polio-paralyzed and recently saw the story on TV of how live Polio virus was used for a phase 1 trial using persons with a cancerous brain tumor. As these tumors are encapsulated, the polio virus cannot escape the tumor to bother other parts of the body. The phase 1 study was to determine the correct dosage of Polio virus. Two individuals had the cancerous tumor completed killed. When the dosage was increased in other patients in the study, there was at least one death. They found that the increased virus that was introduced was too large and signaled the body's natural immune system to attack with big guns, causing fatal brain swelling.
                              I'm sorry if my explanation is off, but I was left happy that the Polio virus was finally good for something.
                              I also feel that such breakthroughs will have to occur with SCI research, even though it's probably no where near the funding of cancer research. There must be scientists out there who can 'think outside the box' and make it happen.

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