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Breaking News: Paralyzed Man Stands, Moves With Epidural Stimulation

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  • #31
    Originally posted by StemCells&AtomBombs View Post
    Sorry, I haven't accepted my wheelchair yet. This is a temporary situation, because real regeneration work is going on.
    Let's face it, they've been working on this thing for a number of years and a lot of money was spent on it. They were trying to develop this before all the trials started last year and this year and they had to show something for it. So they got to hype it up.
    It's good for him, that's fine, but we shouldn't resign ourselves. The press is making it as some kind of cure, and this will hurt us in terms of money for a real cure.
    In terms of his bladder and bowel control, really? He can now feel it and go like he used to? No, he can't. When this happens, and people walk, we'll know we have the real McCoy, not a fake cure.
    If you stop and read, they specifically say it is NOT a cure but rather an advance that shows that the lumbar region works more impressively and retains a "memory" that was not anticipated.

    Before you spout off about what this is and isn't, get ahold of the Lancet article and read it.
    Every day I wake up is a good one

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    • #32
      Originally posted by peterf View Post
      Well here in the land of the desperate news like this travels like wildfire. This news was aired by the BBC. I would prefer to read a scientific review about the man's SCI condition and what gains were achieved rather than a sensational news broadcast.Like many others before it this news will fizzle out just to be replaced with others.
      Send me an email address via PM and I will send you the actual scientific article.
      Every day I wake up is a good one

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      • #33
        This has some info, but doesn't answer all of the questions.

        http://www.thelancet.com/journals/la...547-3/abstract
        "Our lives begin to end the day
        we become silent about things that matter."
        - Martin Luther King Jr

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        • #34
          Ofcourse it's no cure but I agree that it is exciting and good news. Sure the man was fit, but after being in a wheelchair for almost five years no amount of fitness prior to an injury matters much. I would hope that all SCI patients ever hoping to walk again to try to be as fit as they possibly can and that way your body is READY for a cure when one comes!

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          • #35
            I thought it was anticipated, CC. Wise has written about the central pattern generator working on its own for many years. I don't see the practical application of this therapy in people with chronic complete SCI.
            Originally posted by cheesecake View Post
            If you stop and read, they specifically say it is NOT a cure but rather an advance that shows that the lumbar region works more impressively and retains a "memory" that was not anticipated.
            Please donate a dollar a day at http://justadollarplease.org.
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            • #36
              From 2002:
              Originally posted by Wise Young
              In my opinion, one of the most promising technology for locomotion is spinal cord stimulation to activate the central pattern generator. In Arizona and in Vienna (Austria), they have been putting epidural spinal stimulators at L1. These stimulators can be used to activate full-walking movements. Because it turns on all the appropriate reflexes, people who are only household walkers can become good distance walkers with good energy efficiency. I suspect that such stimulation can be used to activate treadmill locomotion in people who have complete spinal cord injury. This is exciting because it provides a possible solution to the very intense treadmill training that is needed to reverse learned non-use in people. Reversal of learned non-use is something that will probably be necessary to restore voluntary walking in people even with successful regenerative and remyelinative therapies.
              https://www.carecure.net/forum/showp...11&postcount=2

              I can see its practical application once a cure involving regeneration is found. It would be great for rehab and for teaching us how to walk again. But without a cure, I don't see how very many people can take advantage of this therapy. We have jobs and need to work, and don't have the time the individual in the story has to take on this type of treatment for minimal practical gain (without first regenerating our spinal nerve cells)
              Please donate a dollar a day at http://justadollarplease.org.
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              • #37
                If the video I watched is correct and it can make me more independant I'll take it atleast for now. You all talk as if its certain the cure for the cns is right around the corner. Me personally I'm in no position to scoff at any advance that can make life easier...

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Eric.S View Post
                  If the video I watched is correct and it can make me more independant I'll take it atleast for now. You all talk as if its certain the cure for the cns is right around the corner. Me personally I'm in no position to scoff at any advance that can make life easier...
                  I totally agree

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Donnie View Post
                    What video says he got bladder/bowel and sexual function back??
                    It actually said bladder and sexual functions.
                    Last edited by Grange; 05-20-2011, 06:44 PM.
                    L1 Complete - Injury 3/12/06 - Grateful to be alive!!!!

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by rdf View Post
                      From 2002:

                      https://www.carecure.net/forum/showp...11&postcount=2

                      I can see its practical application once a cure involving regeneration is found. It would be great for rehab and for teaching us how to walk again. But without a cure, I don't see how very many people can take advantage of this therapy. We have jobs and need to work, and don't have the time the individual in the story has to take on this type of treatment for minimal practical gain (without first regenerating our spinal nerve cells)

                      Okay ... I am in the "THIS IS POSITIVE NEWS BOAT".... Personally I see this as a therapy to keep muscles from atrophying and contracting like mine have. This may be a therapy to help recondition muscle that have long since forgotten what it is like to receive a message telling them to contract or release. Is it a cure? Who knows but I did not hear it being presented that way.

                      It seems like a pretty significant step to me. (Pun Intended)
                      L1 Complete - Injury 3/12/06 - Grateful to be alive!!!!

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                      • #41
                        That's the thing, it's not "news" to a lot of people. Wise has spoken of this for the past decade.

                        I don't know how it would make anyone independent, if they're not so now. It is a morale booster, for sure, and the weight bearing is great.

                        If you can afford it, then go for it. I would if I had the time, but it looks like a full time endeavor. I can't afford that.
                        Originally posted by Grange View Post
                        Okay ... I am in the "THIS IS POSITIVE NEWS BOAT".... Personally I see this as a therapy to keep muscles from atrophying and contracting like mine have. This may be a therapy to help recondition muscle that have long since forgotten what it is like to receive a message telling them to contract or release. Is it a cure? Who knows but I did not hear it being presented that way.

                        It seems like a pretty significant step to me. (Pun Intended)
                        Please donate a dollar a day at http://justadollarplease.org.
                        Copy and paste this message to the bottom of your signature.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by rdf View Post
                          That's the thing, it's not "news" to a lot of people. Wise has spoken of this for the past decade.

                          I don't know how it would make anyone independent, if they're not so now. It is a morale booster, for sure, and the weight bearing is great.

                          If you can afford it, then go for it. I would if I had the time, but it looks like a full time endeavor. I can't afford that.
                          I agree.

                          This is a propaganda news release to keep SCI in front of the masses. Is that good? Yes, but only to maintain awareness in the same way the breast cancer orgs have popularized that condition. It keeps people motivated to stay on board with us.

                          Outside of that this is only marginally beneficial to a small segment of the SCI population at this point. Could it mean something more to others down the road? Sure but probably not.

                          Bladder, bowel & sexual function are important and great to regain but again, this treatment is only useful for a very small percentage of SCI peeps.

                          I've had people running into my office all day long "did you hear?...blah, blah, blah. Isn't that fantastic?" Then they're puzzled about why I'm "debbie downer" about the news. Presenting them with the facts gives them the impression we're secretly miserable and don't want to hear "good news." This isn't the case but they don't understand for obvious reasons.

                          For those with the time and cash and injury that fit this protocol, more power to you. The rest of us will forge ahead and make the best of our lives one day at a time and hope tomorrow will bring something of much greater significance...
                          "Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty." ~ Thomas Jefferson

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by cheesecake View Post
                            If you stop and read, they specifically say it is NOT a cure but rather an advance that shows that the lumbar region works more impressively and retains a "memory" that was not anticipated.

                            Before you spout off about what this is and isn't, get ahold of the Lancet article and read it.
                            cheese, be nicer ;-)

                            If you look at the whole picture you may suspect that there is something wrong here...
                            I mean the whole picture of SCI research...

                            Then look at the mediatic wave... It smels, don't you think?
                            In God we trust; all others bring data. - Edwards Deming

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                            • #44
                              @Cheese:

                              Edgerton’s group is seeing what activating spinal circuits can do without any connection from above the lesion. “Let’s assume someone figures out how to get axons across the lesion,” he says. “Now when that happens — that connection taps into the spinal cord circuitry — the results can be quite big.”

                              http://newmobility.com/articleView.cfm?id=11828

                              Now consider what Reggie said above and then look at the whole picture of SCI research (I hope you read also other papers), do you come to any possible conclusions?

                              Nothing personal cheese, I just feel you have been screwed too and that surprises me actually.

                              Last question, do you have an idea about how many millions have been spent in this line of research?

                              Paolo
                              In God we trust; all others bring data. - Edwards Deming

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by rdf View Post
                                I thought it was anticipated, CC. Wise has written about the central pattern generator working on its own for many years. I don't see the practical application of this therapy in people with chronic complete SCI.
                                I see a practical application on keeping jobs for people working on this line of research... and there are many followers around the world...
                                I wish idiots couldn't get a PHD...
                                In God we trust; all others bring data. - Edwards Deming

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