Standing desk for paras...

[Mize]

This is my new workstation. It's an iMac Pro with an eGPU (behind the right side monitor). I run macos for most of my work but then it can boot into Windows for games.
My latest dexascan came back with osteoporosis, so I'm hoping an additional hour/day of standing will help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCCd7LiU3kI

[Oddity]

Standing doesn't help with osteo, man. It's been studied. Only standing on a vibrating plate has shown to be of any help. Cool desk though.

[funklab]

Cool setup there.

Nothing wrong with standing, but just FYI, unless they've come out with new data, there's no evidence that standing improves or reverses bone loss in SCI, so you'll still need to be careful with those brittle bones just like we all should be. Can be good for other things, just doesn't seem to help with osteoporosis.

[Mize]

Yeah, I realize static standing won't reverse osteoporosis, but the latest data on leptin being created by bones under load is reason enough to increase standing. I also use a Glider regularly, but what I really want is one of these, but preferably the Ekso model with the data logging of user contribution. Unfortunately Ekso isn't approved for home use and I'm not ready to drop $100k on an exoskeleton in their current state. Make one I can really use for daily life and not just therapy and I'd be all over it.

I also get wicked nerve pain from extended seated sessions in my chair so standing is usually more comfortable.

https://youtu.be/YxfpEtLDbAw

[Mize]

Oddity, you gave me a great idea: drive the Tek-RMD onto a vibrating plate (homemade, not the crazy expensive medical type) placed like one of those plastic mats for desk chairs!

[funklab]

Oddity, you gave me a great idea: drive the Tek-RMD onto a vibrating plate (homemade, not the crazy expensive medical type) placed like one of those plastic mats for desk chairs!

Could make typing quite challenging as you're bouncing all around.

[NW-Will]

We need a group project to design a pair of vibrating plates that could be placed in the foot wells of a standing frame.

[Mize]

We need a group project to design a pair of vibrating plates that could be placed in the foot wells of a standing frame.

I spent some time researching this.
The ideal vibration point for bone mineralization appears to be a 60 Hz frequency with a 4 mm amplitude. This will be very hard to achieve inside a footplate owing to the size of the motor needed to achieve that amplitude.

I do think, however, such a beast could hit 1 mm with some careful design work and, even at that low displacement, the literature points to efficacy.

I'm actually in the process of prototyping a vibrating insole for peripheral neuropathy, so this is a complimentary project on which I'm going to spend some time. Wish me luck!

[NW-Will]

We should start a thread dedicated to this idea.
I would be really interested to read.... where ever you are finding these numbers and what kind of vibration is best.

Those numbers maybe optimal that you have quoted, but surely even small vibration would help?
I only say that as it would be interesting to experiment with some cheap homemade solutions just to see what would be achievable.
Just using the hitachi magic wand(apparently it's lower setting is 89hz) have not verified this.. only because it has reasonable strong motor, readily available etc.
Would like to see the inside of one of the expensive powerplate solutions to see what kind of vibration they are creating.
Would a rotary motor vibration be enough? or should we be looking at pulse motors ?




Joking, but somewhat serious.. how about strapping one of these to each foot ?
While I stand on the standing frame!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Concrete-Vi....c100012.m1985

or with the right amount of search honing .. finding a more appropriate off the shelf motor ?

https://www.dhgate.com/store/product...406759017.html

I spent some time researching this.
The ideal vibration point for bone mineralization appears to be a 60 Hz frequency with a 4 mm amplitude. This will be very hard to achieve inside a footplate owing to the size of the motor needed to achieve that amplitude.

I do think, however, such a beast could hit 1 mm with some careful design work and, even at that low displacement, the literature points to efficacy.

I'm actually in the process of prototyping a vibrating insole for peripheral neuropathy, so this is a complimentary project on which I'm going to spend some time. Wish me luck!

[Mize]

The problem with all those motors is that they have to be pretty big to give a good displacement. I initially thought about a bunch of small vibration motors between two plates, but there's no way to make them run synchronously since you'd need to have all the offset masses be at the same point at start-up and they don't have position sensors. Where I'm headed now is a piston pump into a rugged bladder with a tiny bleed valve between two plates so it would use the pump pressure into the bladder(s) to get the vibration. This way I can use a substantial piston pump and run air lines (that can handle let's say 100 psi) to the bladders between the plates on the two foot pads. Make sense?

Very different from my orthotic project which will use the tiny vibration motors found in cell phones.

[funklab]

What if you built a plate that was 2 or 3 inches high and mostly flat, something like a bathroom scale but big enough for a standing chair to roll up on or to mount a standing frame on top of. It would be low slung, so (hopefully) stable. If you needed to build up the mechanism for the motors you could have the bulky bits in the center of this flat surface, then roll the standing chair backwards up onto it so you wouldn't have to worry about clearance.

[NW-Will]

half serious

how about one of these under each foot while I stand in my standing frame ?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Concrete-Vi...-/152223466946

[Mize]

Hmmm. Need the detailed specs, but maybe...

[Mize]

Frequency is way higher than published research on bone density.
13,000 Hz vs. 60 Hz.

[NW-Will]

It's 13,000 VPM... so 216 vibrations per seconds, would be interesting what it would actually be measured at.
but should be easier to slow it down than speed it up, but would lose some of it's amplitude.