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  • Paying a caregiver by shift

    rather than hourly -- has anyone done that? To get away from having to constantly mind time when working with slow pca's, I am thinking of paying by job done/task completed. I also think, it might be better this way to show the pca is an independent contractor rather than an employee. Is it?

    This way time sheets showing hours in and out are unnecessary, but what paper work should substitute that? Just some sort of attendance sheet?

    SCI-Nurse/KLD, thanks very much for PCA Agreement template you posted here. I am going to start with this as the basis of our contract.

    Thanks all.

  • #2
    Salary only, anything else

    Originally posted by Quad62 View Post
    rather than hourly -- has anyone done that? To get away from having to constantly mind time when working with slow pca's, I am thinking of paying by job done/task completed. I also think, it might be better this way to show the pca is an independent contractor rather than an employee. Is it?

    This way time sheets showing hours in and out are unnecessary, but what paper work should substitute that? Just some sort of attendance sheet?

    SCI-Nurse/KLD, thanks very much for PCA Agreement template you posted here. I am going to start with this as the basis of our contract.

    Thanks all.

    and you'll be at the mercy of the sloths

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    • #3
      We started doing a 2hr mn pay even if done sooner. For non BP days and the nights we have someone come over to put Dave in bed, brush teeth etc it usually takes less time. This way it seems like they are in and out quicker and I don't feel like am keeping track of every minute.
      BP/shower days can take up to 3 hours.

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      • #4
        Tim C., I see your concern about them being slow in response. I was hoping their fear of losing the job if wasting time would take care of that. I could easily communicate that formally or informally.

        LindaT, do you pay for two hr min for nights as well (on non BP days), or do you pay 2 hr min for the entire day including morning and night (on non BP days) even though the caregiver makes two trips?

        KLD, what is better? Paying by hour or by the job?

        Comment


        • #5
          'Tim C., I see your concern about them being slow in response. I was hoping their fear of losing the job if wasting time would take care of that. I could easily communicate that formally or informally.'

          i say this because, depending on your particular demographics, caregiver jobs for sci are considered bottom rung of the ladder for the most undesirable jobs, and as such, these jobs tend to out-number the available labor pool to fill them.
          that said, i'd venture to say that many caregivers don't value their jobs enough to fret over the potential loss of them. caregivers can usually find another job in a flash, especially since companion jobs don't pay that much less. Watching tv, and escorting the elderly about town beats doing dig-stims bp's any time.
          Just my observation [as a veteran of over 41 caregivers over 8 miserable sci years]

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Tim C. View Post
            'Tim C., I see your concern about them being slow in response. I was hoping their fear of losing the job if wasting time would take care of that. I could easily communicate that formally or informally.'

            i say this because, depending on your particular demographics, caregiver jobs for sci are considered bottom rung of the ladder for the most undesirable jobs, and as such, these jobs tend to out-number the available labor pool to fill them.
            that said, i'd venture to say that many caregivers don't value their jobs enough to fret over the potential loss of them. caregivers can usually find another job in a flash, especially since companion jobs don't pay that much less. Watching tv, and escorting the elderly about town beats doing dig-stims bp's any time.
            Just my observation [as a veteran of over 41 caregivers over 8 miserable sci years]
            It is easier to help a tiny elderly lady to the bathroom and cut her toast
            than to do everything a high level quad needs. For that reason it has been nearly impossible for us to find people.
            We started doing the 2 hour mn to make it worthwhile even if it might not take much more then an hour at bedtime. On BP/shower day we pay per hour, mn 3.
            We don't have an aide every night and sometimes none in the morning. Dave also has a 15 mn Vest breathing treatment before he gets up and after is in bed.
            Last edited by LindaT; 04-16-2010, 06:04 PM.

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            • #7
              I have always essentially just paid for the shift, and I think it works out great. When I hire a caregiver, there are a set number of hours that each shift should require. Since nobody wants to be at work longer than they have to, I've never found myself "at the mercy of the sloths". If they can finish quicker, they're essentially getting paid a better hourly rate, and it saves me time too! On the other hand, if they take more than their allotted time, they'll figure out how to do the job quicker since they aren't getting paid for the extra time.

              When unexpected things come up, I let them add time on a case-by-case basis.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by EyesOfTexas View Post
                I have always essentially just paid for the shift, and I think it works out great. When I hire a caregiver, there are a set number of hours that each shift should require. Since nobody wants to be at work longer than they have to, I've never found myself "at the mercy of the sloths". If they can finish quicker, they're essentially getting paid a better hourly rate, and it saves me time too! On the other hand, if they take more than their allotted time, they'll figure out how to do the job quicker since they aren't getting paid for the extra time.

                When unexpected things come up, I let them add time on a case-by-case basis.
                You said it better than I did-those are the reasons we pay by shift.

                Comment


                • #9
                  be careful of time-incentive shifts too

                  Originally posted by EyesOfTexas View Post
                  I have always essentially just paid for the shift, and I think it works out great. When I hire a caregiver, there are a set number of hours that each shift should require. Since nobody wants to be at work longer than they have to, I've never found myself "at the mercy of the sloths". If they can finish quicker, they're essentially getting paid a better hourly rate, and it saves me time too! On the other hand, if they take more than their allotted time, they'll figure out how to do the job quicker since they aren't getting paid for the extra time.

                  When unexpected things come up, I let them add time on a case-by-case basis.
                  in time-incentive shifts workers tend to learn how to get the job done sooner by cutting corners, so you need to verify that the work is completed in full and to your standards.
                  good luck.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Tim C. View Post
                    in time-incentive shifts workers tend to learn how to get the job done sooner by cutting corners, so you need to verify that the work is completed in full and to your standards.
                    good luck.
                    Agreed. It's definitely important to make sure that the job gets done completely every time. It's best to train well at the beginning so that the worker gets into a good routine, and say something immediately if it seems like corners are being cut.

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                    • #11
                      MOST import is that the cg use good hygene, not just to

                      protect themselves but your loved one using generally accepted practices with stomas, urine collection, skin care, etc.
                      i had a cg not bothering to dry my skin properly, noticing beginning skin issues, or caring for catheters......but he got me ready on time each day.

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                      • #12
                        We have contracted with PCAs both ways...by the job ("do these 6 tasks and get paid this much") and time ("complete these tasks during the time period 0730-0930 and be present at those times"). There are pros and cons for each way. Either way you need to build in QUALITY issues into the contract, and reinforce this with regular supervision meetings with the PCA. Your individual situation and needs will dictate which works best for you for which activities and for the particular PCA. Just be sure it is fully spelled out in the contract (which of course you will have in writing with each individual PCA).

                        (KLD)
                        The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

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                        • #13
                          I have paid by the shift for years a wouldn't go back to paying by the hour. Keeping track of time is just one more hassle I don't need to deal with. I pay the same amount regardless of whether it's a BP day or not (I go MWF, but it can shift) again one less thing to keep track of. I pay more for a morning shift than the evening shift because that is when most of my care occurs. Evenings are just cooking, feeding, cleaning, and putting me to bed. When hiring I tell the prospect the approximate hours and let them know they could be more, but will usually be less. This also makes budgeting easier for myself and my caregiver. I know to budget x dollars every two weeks and my caregiver knows they will be paid x dollars every two weeks. Either way communication is key, cut off bad habits when they begin, but don't sweat the small stuff.

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                          • #14
                            I have always taken care of quality of service with direct communication. However, it seems like a good idea to also include it in the written agreement for the caregiver. Thanks all.

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