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  • Valium

    I've been taking 5mg of valium three times a day for spasms for around 28yrs. All of sudden my home healthcare agency wants the nurses to start counting the valium daily. I get a three month supply through a mail service. That's 270 pills. Is this something new?

  • #2
    It is a common drug of abuse, and a controlled substance (similar to opioids). I suppose they are monitoring your use to be sure you have not increased your dose beyond that which is prescribed. Does the nurse from the agency help administer it for you?

    (KLD)
    The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

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    • #3
      Pill counts by visiting Nurses are nothing new. It's intended as a way to document that you're taking the medication as prescribed and that none of it is being diverted.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by SCI-Nurse View Post
        It is a common drug of abuse, and a controlled substance (similar to opioids). I suppose they are monitoring your use to be sure you have not increased your dose beyond that which is prescribed. Does the nurse from the agency help administer it for you?

        (KLD)
        My prescription is for three times a day prn. Some days I only take two. My wife gives it to me at night and on the weekends. The nurses give it to me Mon-Fri in the morning and the afternoon if I need it.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by 2drwhofans View Post
          Pill counts by visiting Nurses are nothing new. It's intended as a way to document that you're taking the medication as prescribed and that none of it is being diverted.
          I understand. But 270 pills? If someone miss counts one day it can turn ugly real quick.
          Last edited by HACKNSACK44; 09-18-2018, 11:15 PM.

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          • #6
            I wouldnt let them count my meds.

            Originally posted by HACKNSACK44 View Post
            I've been taking 5mg of valium three times a day for spasms for around 28yrs. All of sudden my home healthcare agency wants the nurses to start counting the valium daily. I get a three month supply through a mail service. That's 270 pills. Is this something new?
            I'd lock up the valium. That is prescribed by a doctor for you and you only. I have read many stories where health aides steal controlled substances like valium and pain killers to feed their habit. It's none of their business to count your meds healthcare company protocol or not.

            I take 4mg of clonazepam/klonopin (benzodiazepine) for restless leg syndrome and spasms in my legs during the night so I can get a good night of sleep for work the next day. My doctor took me off valium and put on klonopin and it works just the same and it is addictive but I've been on for more than 25 years and it work wonders for me.

            Once when I ran out of refills on a Friday night and could not get refilled till Monday. After 24 hours I slowly started to go through very severe withdrawal symptoms; jittery, light sensitive, noise sensitive, muscle tightness all over my body, severe muscle spasms, legs jumping all over the place, irritability, confusion, shaking, jumpy, constantly moving and spaciness. My wife wanted to take me to the ER but I told her to go and pick up my prescription at the drug store once it got refilled. She brought it home and I took two tablets and within an hour I was back to normal. ER visit $350 co-pay, Rx $3 co-pay.

            I am absolutely against healthcare personnel counting clients prescribed medicines especially in your own home. You do I say, I am the home owner.

            Ti
            "We must overcome difficulties rather than being overcome by difficulties."

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by HACKNSACK44 View Post
              I understand. But 270 pills? If someone miss counts one day it will turn ugly real quick.
              "Visiting Nurse." I don't understand what a "Visiting Nurse" is in the United States.

              I know that there are visiting nurses in the United Kingdom that are involved by something called a sector or region, but what does "Visiting Nurse" mean in the United States? What kind of insurance do you have? Does your insurance company rely upon your "visiting nurse" (how do they provide this person to moderate your medications?) No one comes to my house and counts the medications that are administered to me...that is all between me, NL and my physician.

              If you could provide more information about how this visiting nurse person has control over the medications you take, it would be educational for me....because I've not had the experience of this limitation.

              While editing my post, read TI's post...agree, no one comes into my house and dictates the medications that I take either.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by HACKNSACK44 View Post
                I understand. But 270 pills? If someone miss counts one day it will turn ugly real quick.
                Or what happens if one of those counters pockets a few... I'd be more worried about that than anything else.

                Benzodiazepines (the class of drug that Valium is in) have come back into vogue for young folks today (although they pretty much universally prefer Xanax or fake Chinese Xanax purchased over the internet). A quick search at streetRx.com shows that your 270 pills are worth somewhere between $5 and $10 each, so that's not an insignificant amount of money if you were to start selling them on the street. I'm sure they're worried about diversion (pills being sold or stolen) and the pill count is to make sure that you're not using 1 or 2 pills a day and then suddenly 20 or 50 pills go missing because you had someone come over and buy some off of you.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by gjnl View Post
                  "Visiting Nurse." I don't understand what a "Visiting Nurse" is in the United States.

                  I know that there are visiting nurses in the United Kingdom that are involved by something called a sector or region, but what does "Visiting Nurse" mean in the United States? What kind of insurance do you have? Does your insurance company rely upon your "visiting nurse" (how do they provide this person to moderate your medications?) No one comes to my house and counts the medications that are administered to me...that is all between me, NL and my physician.

                  If you could provide more information about how this visiting nurse person has control over the medications you take, it would be educational for me....because I've not had the experience of this limitation.

                  While editing my post, read TI's post...agree, no one comes into my house and dictates the medications that I take either.
                  Visiting nurse? I have an lpn nurse Mon-Fri 12hrs a day through a home health agency. The agency said the nurses had to start counting the valium daily. They have never counted the valium before. I don't know if it's something to do with the state (Fl) or the agency itself. They are not dictating what medications I take. They just want to count them.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Just say no!

                    Originally posted by funklab View Post
                    Or what happens if one of those counters pockets a few... I'd be more worried about that than anything else.

                    Benzodiazepines (the class of drug that Valium is in) have come back into vogue for young folks today (although they pretty much universally prefer Xanax or fake Chinese Xanax purchased over the internet). A quick search at streetRx.com shows that your 270 pills are worth somewhere between $5 and $10 each, so that's not an insignificant amount of money if you were to start selling them on the street. I'm sure they're worried about diversion (pills being sold or stolen) and the pill count is to make sure that you're not using 1 or 2 pills a day and then suddenly 20 or 50 pills go missing because you had someone come over and buy some off of you.
                    If HACKNSACK44 sold between 20-50 of his vaiums on the street he is committing his own suicide. He is now short about 17 days at the end of his prescription and he will go through very severe withdrawal symptoms like I described in my post. He may even have a seizure and be fatal. You don't quite cold turkey for being on valium for 27 years.

                    As gjnl posted that prescription is between HACKNSACK44 and his doctor.

                    Ti
                    "We must overcome difficulties rather than being overcome by difficulties."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by titanium4motion View Post
                      If HACKNSACK44 sold between 20-50 of his vaiums on the street he is committing his own suicide. He is now short about 17 days at the end of his prescription and he will go through very severe withdrawal symptoms like I described in my post. He may even have a seizure and be fatal. You don't quite cold turkey for being on valium for 27 years.

                      As gjnl posted that prescription is between HACKNSACK44 and his doctor.

                      Ti
                      You are right. I'm going to talk to the agency tomorrow.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by titanium4motion View Post
                        If HACKNSACK44 sold between 20-50 of his vaiums on the street he is committing his own suicide. He is now short about 17 days at the end of his prescription and he will go through very severe withdrawal symptoms like I described in my post. He may even have a seizure and be fatal. You don't quite cold turkey for being on valium for 27 years.

                        As gjnl posted that prescription is between HACKNSACK44 and his doctor.

                        Ti
                        True, but the state (or whomever is dictating this new procedure) doesn't know that HACKNSACK takes his valium every day. For all they know he hasn't taken a pill in 27 years and has been supplementing his income slanging them on the streets.

                        I met a guy who was prescribed four different opioid prescriptions with a total street value in excess of $20,000 per month. He openly admitted to not taking 3 of the prescriptions at all and taking a much lower dose of oxycodone than he was prescribed, yet he continued to fill the prescriptions like clockwork every month. He told me he had $150,000 worth of opioids "in a safe" at his house "just in case", but we both knew he was lying. He was making a very good living selling his medications, he probably didn't get full street value for them, but I bet he made six figures cash every year from dealing the drugs wholesale, which is a pretty decent supplement to SSD.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I don't buy it.

                          Originally posted by funklab View Post
                          True, but the state (or whomever is dictating this new procedure) doesn't know that HACKNSACK takes his valium every day. For all they know he hasn't taken a pill in 27 years and has been supplementing his income slanging them on the streets.

                          I met a guy who was prescribed four different opioid prescriptions with a total street value in excess of $20,000 per month. He openly admitted to not taking 3 of the prescriptions at all and taking a much lower dose of oxycodone than he was prescribed, yet he continued to fill the prescriptions like clockwork every month. He told me he had $150,000 worth of opioids "in a safe" at his house "just in case", but we both knew he was lying. He was making a very good living selling his medications, he probably didn't get full street value for them, but I bet he made six figures cash every year from dealing the drugs wholesale, which is a pretty decent supplement to SSD.
                          I was on morphine sulfate 30mg 6 times a day for my first shoulder injury year 2007. I was seeing a pain management doctor for this. On some visits for refill I was surprised by the doctor. He knock on the door and I replied, "Enter." and came in and said to me, "Drug test. We need a sample of your urine." If I failed the drug test I was rejected out of my treatment plan but I past all of them. I don't buy your story. This guy had to take a drug test somewhere along his plan. They check for all drugs in your system. If morphine sulfate was not presence in my urine I would have failed the drug test and rejected out.

                          Ti
                          Last edited by titanium4motion; 09-19-2018, 12:07 AM.
                          "We must overcome difficulties rather than being overcome by difficulties."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Actually, I think you will find that counting (by two nurses) is required by the agency because this med is administered by one of your home health LPNs. If you self administered only, then I suspect they wouldn't care. Sadly, drug diversion by health care professionals is rampant in hospitals and home care. They are monitoring their own staff...not you.

                            (KLD)
                            The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by titanium4motion View Post
                              I was on morphine sulfate 30g 6 times a day for my first shoulder injury year 2007. I was seeing a pain management doctor for this. On some visits for refill I was surprised by the doctor. He knock on the door and I replied, "Enter." and came in and said to me, "Drug test. We need a sample of your urine." If I failed the drug test I was rejected out of my treatment plan but I past all of them. I don't buy your story. This guy had to take a drug test somewhere along his plan. They check for all drugs in your system. If morphine sulfate was not presence in my urine I would have failed the drug test and rejected out.

                              Ti
                              I have never taken a drug test for valium.

                              Comment

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