Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

non weight bearing and breaking bones

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #16
    Originally posted by SCIfor55yrs. View Post
    You should do a CC search for other threads on this topic. Standing is not going to do any good. Research indicates that stress to the bones by muscle activity is necessary to slow or prevent osteoporosis in SCIs. There are at least a few CC members who are using functional electrical stimulation (FES) to accomplish that. Other experimentation is going on with vibrating platforms to stand on. The available medications available do not seem to do much if any good either. In sum, there really is not a whole lot you can do about the osteoporosis.
    Originally posted by SCI-Nurse View Post
    As above, research studies have shown that passive standing alone does nothing to prevent or treat osteoporsis in those with SCI. There appears to be a need to have active muscle contraction and stress on the bone to maintain its density after SCI. FES has been shown to be effective, and there are promising results from standing on a vibrating plate of the proper applitude and frequency of vibration.

    Additionally, use of drugs such as Forteo or other biphosphonates have NOT been shown in to be effective in reducing osteoporosis in those areas which are at the highest risk for people with SCI. These areas are the distal femur (just above the knee), the proximal tibia (just below the knee) and the sub-trochanteric femur (just below the hip bone). The first two of these are rarely evaluated in a DEXA scan, as most machines do not have the software to assess those locations. Most DEXA machines are set up to scan the lumbar spine, hip, and wrist areas as these are the areas which have the most osteoporosis in post-menopausal women. In people with SCI, it is common that the lumbar spine is not osteoporotic, and it may even have better density that in those who are AB.

    Supplementation with calcium and vitamin D has not been shown to be effective either, and can increase your risks for urinary stones.

    Avoiding trauma is important to prevent fractures. Falls are the #1 cause, but doing activities that twist your lower legs should also be avoided. I have been with SCI clients when they broke a hip rolling over in bed, or allowing their leg to drop after having crossed their legs for putting on shoes (you can nearly always hear it in a quiet room). We recently had a client who was in a relatively minor car accident while seated in hiw wheelchair in his van, where his knees hit the dashboard...he has bilateral femur fractures. We had a member on these forums who broke both femurs when doing a tandem sky diving event, not due to striking the ground with his feet, but due to his legs flying up in the air when the chute was deployed.

    (KLD)
    Agree with these two, and for those of you who like to read here is a more robust article...

    link

    The article basically says weight bearing doesn't do anything, neither does using an FES bike once a week, but if you use an FES bike 3x a week the participants were averaging 10% increase in bone mineral density... which to me isn't that impressive for the time commitment... article also states you lose roughly 50% of BMD in the first 3 years of complete SCI.

    Comment


      #17
      Originally posted by SCI-Nurse View Post
      Unless you are moving the pedals actively with your leg muscles and at the same time load bearing through your leg bones, it is unlikely that this type of semi-recumbent bike activity will do much if anything to prevent or correct osteoporosis. Still good exercise for cardio, but not for osteoporosis prevention.

      (KLD)
      Thanks for responding KLD. I know the T-score values below are not the proper bones that you listed for SCI but here they are over 4 years. Osteopenia in Left femoral neck and Left hip.

      Left femoral neck T-score values:
      9/15/14: -2.3
      8/9/12: -2.4
      2/12/10: -2.4

      Left hip T-score values:
      9/15/14: -1.9
      8/9/12: -1.8
      2/12/10: -2.3

      Lumbar spine T-score values:
      9/15/14: -0.4
      8/9/12: -0.3
      2/12/10: -0.3

      Comment


        #18
        Sorry KLD but studies and articles indicate folks can optimize bone density and improve heart health by taking Vitamin D3 and K2.

        http://articles.mercola.com/sites/ar...itamin-k2.aspx

        http://www.lef.org/magazine/2009/1/v...-aging/page-01

        http://www.healthsecretsusa.com/inde...&product_id=86

        http://www.betterbones.com/bonenutri.../benefits.aspx

        http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/509074_4

        Comment


          #19
          Smokey, none of those articles mention SCI. I didn't read each article in their entirety, but none of them mention a study where a group of people had their bone densities assessed before and after a bout of supplementation with any of these products, controlling for all other variables like exercise, and comparing those results to a control group who did not go on these supplements. Even if they did mention those types of studies, they would have to be done on individuals with SCI to show any benefit to SCI.

          What works for able-bodied people with fully functioning nervous systems will not necessarily work for those with SCI, even if you are incomplete and can get your muscles to contract and put stress on the bone. It is possible to improve bone density after SCI, but that ability depends on the individual. There has not been one method that's been shown to work for everyone.

          Comment


            #20
            Originally posted by smokey View Post
            Sorry KLD but studies and articles indicate folks can optimize bone density and improve heart health by taking Vitamin D3 and K2.
            What tomsonite said.

            (KLD)
            The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

            Comment


              #21
              how do you know when a bone breaks?

              Comment


                #22
                Diagnosing fractures in someone with SCI can be very tricky. There may be swelling (not immediate, but after several hours), but this needs to be considered along with other causes of swelling such as a DVT, dependent edema, or even too tight of a leg bag strap. Some people will have pain (if they are incomplete) but of course that is inconsistent. Many people hear the bone break if it occurs in a quiet environment (I have heard this myself). AD can occur also, often delayed several hours after the event. Rarely is the limb angulated (bent at the fracture site instead of just at the joint), but that obviously would be an important sign to look for if it is there.

                We have a high level of suspicion with any fall, and don't hesitate to get Xrays if a patient reports a fall.

                (KLD)
                The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by PC720 View Post
                  how do you know when a bone breaks?
                  Assuming you are referring to a limb:

                  You may hear a dull snapping sound when it occurs.

                  Redness, swelling...sometimes mistaken for a DVT. It is always best to er on the safe side and get an x-ray of the area.

                  The part of the limb beyond the break may rotate more than usual.

                  High level SCIs may experience AD and an increase in spasticity.

                  In some extreme instances the bone may protrude through the muscle/skin.
                  You will find a guide to preserving shoulder function @
                  http://www.rstce.pitt.edu/RSTCE_Reso...imb_Injury.pdf

                  See my personal webpage @
                  http://cccforum55.freehostia.com/

                  Comment


                    #24
                    the reason I ask is because I have heard my hips snap and pop several times. I get xrays but they tell me there's nothing wrong. I know I have osteoarthritis and the orthopedic surgeon told me the discomfort I feel in my hips is probably from excess stretching. as of right now its far as I know I do not have any broken bones but I would like to be proactive

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Joint popping can also be an indication of a joint dislocation; or just a popping joint. That sound is pretty different than the "snap" I have heard with bone fractures.

                      (KLD)
                      The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        All 4 of my lower leg breaks, I heard the crack

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Give me Vitamin K2 anyway; http://www.co.orange.ny.us/filestora...ED_9-19-14.pdf

                          Comment


                            #28
                            My daughter is 11, is osteoporotic and a very active and even though she stands daily she has has 2 fractures but both have causes. the first was ramming into the tables at school- right at her knee level-fractured femur jut above knee and the second was while in stirrups on a horse another horse bumped up against her and push the ankle inwards. it was what they call an avulsion fracture which means cracked on one side of the bone and bent on the other. if she was wearing her AFO's (foot and ankle splints ) she probably would have been fine. Both times it was days before we realized. swelling and general bad form including tummy pain. both times she was casted bivalved and heeled after 4 weeks.was allowed to stress joint by standing stretching straight away. We have started FES but lucky to do once a week. this post may encourage me to do more but difficult to get a child interested. Standing good for bowel and bladder and spasms.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              I've had back pain for a long time and figured it was due to always sitting. Then the pain got way worse so I got it checked out and had compression fractures to my t12, l2 and l3 vertebrae. My doctors determined that the fractures were old. I figure I started feeling the pain now due to being incomplete and regaining more sensation. I still don't know how it happened though. In the 4 years since my sci my only falls have been flipping my chair over backwards 2 times.

                              Will using leg braces with a walker help bone density? When I use my hkafo braces I lift myself up and swing both legs forward at once. Almost like I'm hopping
                              c6 inc since 2-19-11
                              ex pro-am motocross racer
                              tilite aero z s2

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Compression fractures are most likely found in areas of your spine near the areas of spinal fusions or where the original spinal cord injury occurred. Many times occurring in the part of the spine where the bones are the most vulnerable. Pain medication and calcitonin spray are two medications that are helpful for treatment
                                The SCI-Nurses are advanced practice nurses specializing in SCI/D care. They are available to answer questions, provide education, and make suggestions which you should always discuss with your physician/primary health care provider before implementing. Medical diagnosis is not provided, nor do the SCI-Nurses provide nursing or medical care through their responses on the CareCure forums.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X