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Microcyn Bladder Treatment (An Open Letter to Dr. Young)

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  • Originally posted by Regine View Post
    Uuups, just read a new e-mail from fribamed which represents Oculus in Germany, that there i s a difference in concentration, but that Vetericyn VF is not safe for humans because it would cause irritations, and that it is only that strong to get through thick animal skin, and will not be available for human beings in the near future.
    This is complete nonsense. I have treated a deep deep ulcer with it with success, and used it successfully on my bladder where Dermacyn has failed. What is this all about? Why is a safe and excellent treatment not available, just to feed us antibiotics which will eventually create resistant bacteria? I can't help but think, that this is all about politics. You guys can get it through amazon.com, and we Europeans have to find a veterinarian who breaks the law to get this miracle water...??
    Can't Susanne use her contacts to help with this issue?
    Regine

    Here in the U.S., Microcyn nor Vetericyn is approved by the FDA for internal use. We use it "Off Label" when we inject it into our bladders. There were 4 of us on this forum that was invited to a conference call with Oculus, Inc. and the University of Alabama Birmingham to discuss our use of the Microcyn technology. The urologist asked a lot of questions of each of us about our experience.

    It can be used anywhere saline can be used and is as safe as water. Over 3 million patients and not a single report of serious adverse reactions.

    I hope this helps.

    Millard
    ''Life's tough... it's even tougher if you're stupid!'' -- John Wayne

    Comment


    • That is quite number! I still think it's a scandal to withhold this treatment. Our news are full of people dying from MRSA, even babies.
      I might end up having the VVF sent to me from the U.S., but am suspicious what customs will make of this. They might keep it and send it back, unless we fill it in harmless bottles and lie. Isn't that like in the Middle Ages??
      Thanks for all your input.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Regine View Post
        That is quite number! I still think it's a scandal to withhold this treatment. Our news are full of people dying from MRSA, even babies.
        I might end up having the VVF sent to me from the U.S., but am suspicious what customs will make of this. They might keep it and send it back, unless we fill it in harmless bottles and lie. Isn't that like in the Middle Ages??
        Thanks for all your input.
        yeah depends on your countries customs poicies I guess. I live in Canada and get mine from the USA no problem. Maybe just order a bottle or two and see if it comes across with no issues, then place a large order. Make sure you order it in the spring or summer so it doesn't freeze. If it freezes while it's being shipped it's pretty much garbage.
        Mark 9:23 - All things are possible for those who believe.

        Comment


        • So looks like this treatment can be used in a variety of ways. Has anyone Written formal documentation on how to best flush using a 60 mL syringe with a SP catheter. I found this post but wasn't sure if this is the best practice.

          /forum/showpost.php?p=1196568&postcount=26


          Is this something that is done twice daily?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Chaz19 View Post
            So looks like this treatment can be used in a variety of ways. Has anyone Written formal documentation on how to best flush using a 60 mL syringe with a SP catheter. I found this post but wasn't sure if this is the best practice.

            /forum/showpost.php?p=1196568&postcount=26


            Is this something that is done twice daily?
            As you have read by now, there is no one size fits all amount of Vetericyn, fixed time retained in the bladder, number of times a day used, number of days used.

            What I can say is that those who are using 60cc started out using that much, maybe twice a day to get rid of an infection. Many of us have been able to back off that much to a maintenance level once our bladder infections are cleared up or there is no longer any evidence of colonization. Many people have started using Vetericyn about mid antibiotic course in curing an infection.

            My personal testimonial is that I managed my bladder for about 15 years with intermittent catheterization. Toward the end of that period, I suffered from recurrent UTIs. While getting these UTIs under control, I consulted with a specialist about techniques to manage my neurogenic bladder. I decided to have a supra pubic catheter placed about 20 months ago, once the infections were under control. It was then that I read about Vetericyn on this website. I began using it and have not had an infection in 20 months. Once a day (at bedtime), I instill 20cc of Vetericyn, mixed with 10cc of sterile saline into my bladder. I plug/clamp the catheter for about 24-30 minutes and then drain the bladder. I don't have a bacteria colonized bladder, and my urine is clear, light, and odorless. I have not had an infection in those 20 months.

            All the best,
            GJ

            Comment


            • Originally posted by gjnl View Post
              As you have read by now, there is no one size fits all amount of Vetericyn, fixed time retained in the bladder, number of times a day used, number of days used.

              What I can say is that those who are using 60cc started out using that much, maybe twice a day to get rid of an infection. Many of us have been able to back off that much to a maintenance level once our bladder infections are cleared up or there is no longer any evidence of colonization. Many people have started using Vetericyn about mid antibiotic course in curing an infection.

              My personal testimonial is that I managed my bladder for about 15 years with intermittent catheterization. Toward the end of that period, I suffered from recurrent UTIs. While getting these UTIs under control, I consulted with a specialist about techniques to manage my neurogenic bladder. I decided to have a supra pubic catheter placed about 20 months ago, once the infections were under control. It was then that I read about Vetericyn on this website. I began using it and have not had an infection in 20 months. Once a day (at bedtime), I instill 20cc of Vetericyn, mixed with 10cc of sterile saline into my bladder. I plug/clamp the catheter for about 24-30 minutes and then drain the bladder. I don't have a bacteria colonized bladder, and my urine is clear, light, and odorless. I have not had an infection in those 20 months.

              All the best,
              GJ

              Like GJ, I have been plagued with uti's for the last 42 years and then I tried using Microcyn/Vetericyn. For the last 20 months, I have been uti free and colonization free.

              I intermittent cath so I just inject 20ml of Vetericyn VF into my bladder and leave it there until I cath again. I do this procedure three times per week. As GJ indicated, the best way is experiment with yourself. When you find what works best for you, post it here.

              Good luck.
              Millard
              ''Life's tough... it's even tougher if you're stupid!'' -- John Wayne

              Comment


              • Microcyn/Vetericyn

                Hi everyone

                Been awhile since my last post...about six months i guess. In my previous posts i discussed my lower leg sores,from the knee down. I have seen multiple Dermatologists thru the years.Almost six years worth of punch biopisis..scrapes...even removing a section of flesh to analyze.Multiple regiments of antibiotics...creams...lotions.Wrapping legs with soaked gauze bandages with bactraban and eucerin lotion mixture....then wrapped with ace bandage. Tried bee honey from australia...or some place like that.My last dermatologist...6 months ago said he had no doubt my leg wounds were due to my immune system. Was put on Methatrexate and Folic acid.The Folic acid to keep the Methatrexate from damaging my liver.6 months later..and legs still horrible looking, with big sores full of stinking yellow pus.

                My toenails continue to fall off. When i first tried Microcyn...i had some improvement. Then switched to Vetricyn VF for the double strength.I was amazed how the sores started drying up..and the scabs were just falling off. But i am sad to say that after awhile the Vetericyn VF stopped working. Now leg wounds are once again looking and smelling the same.I use puppy pads under my legs to absorb all the drainage...which at times smells like urine.

                My aide is washing my legs with Hibiclens...and then VetVF...but nothing changes.After 6 yrs....i'm tired of it all.Right now i'm on the wound-vac system for a pressuse sore on my right hip.I'm under the care of a general surgeon for my wound care. After i'm healed i'm..Seriously....SERIOUSLY...considering above the knee amputation of both legs.Being people that could or might understand how i feel after being frustrated for so long.Would you be willing to give me your most heartfelt opinion. I' a C6 quad since 1994.

                Thanks
                william

                Comment


                • I have read about microcyn gel though the information is not clear and I have not been able to readmthis whole thread. Is anyone cathing with microcyn gel as a lubricant and are they getting any results in the reduction of colonization?

                  Second, as the last poster is doing, would injecting 20ml straight into the bladder from one cath to another work? Would that be the best indication of use? Any possible side effects? Last, where do you buy this.
                  T6 complete (or so I think), SCI since September 21, 2003

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by william View Post
                    Hi everyone

                    Been awhile since my last post...about six months i guess. In my previous posts i discussed my lower leg sores,from the knee down. I have seen multiple Dermatologists thru the years.Almost six years worth of punch biopisis..scrapes...even removing a section of flesh to analyze.Multiple regiments of antibiotics...creams...lotions.Wrapping legs with soaked gauze bandages with bactraban and eucerin lotion mixture....then wrapped with ace bandage. Tried bee honey from australia...or some place like that.My last dermatologist...6 months ago said he had no doubt my leg wounds were due to my immune system. Was put on Methatrexate and Folic acid.The Folic acid to keep the Methatrexate from damaging my liver.6 months later..and legs still horrible looking, with big sores full of stinking yellow pus.

                    My toenails continue to fall off. When i first tried Microcyn...i had some improvement. Then switched to Vetricyn VF for the double strength.I was amazed how the sores started drying up..and the scabs were just falling off. But i am sad to say that after awhile the Vetericyn VF stopped working. Now leg wounds are once again looking and smelling the same.I use puppy pads under my legs to absorb all the drainage...which at times smells like urine.

                    My aide is washing my legs with Hibiclens...and then VetVF...but nothing changes.After 6 yrs....i'm tired of it all.Right now i'm on the wound-vac system for a pressuse sore on my right hip.I'm under the care of a general surgeon for my wound care. After i'm healed i'm..Seriously....SERIOUSLY...considering above the knee amputation of both legs.Being people that could or might understand how i feel after being frustrated for so long.Would you be willing to give me your most heartfelt opinion. I' a C6 quad since 1994.

                    Thanks
                    Your frustration is understandable, but amputation is a drastic step. Amputation of your legs would change the way you sit in your wheelchair because of weight and balance changes. You would have to find positioning devices and changes to your posture to compensate for the loss of the limbs and pressure issues could become a problem.

                    Have you been tested for diabetes? Have you been tested for vascular insufficiency? Either of these conditions could be causing the lesions you describe.

                    I don't know if you aware of this, but there is a Microcyn/Vetericyn gel product that may be more effective for these sores.
                    Microcyn-based hydrogel products contain over 95% water. Moisture supplied to the wound by these gels creates a moist wound environment that re-hydrates necrotic tissue and promotes autolysis. These processes assist with natural debridement thus enhancing the healing process.
                    Reference: http://www.oculusis.com/us/microcyn/

                    WoundSource (http://www.woundsource.com/product/m...wound-hydrogel) has this posted on their website:
                    Microcyn® Skin and Wound HydroGel
                    Microcyn® Skin and Wound HydroGel is indicated for management of exudating wounds such as leg ulcers, pressure ulcers, diabetic ulcers, first- and second-degree burns and mechanically or surgically debrided wounds.

                    Microcyn® Skin and Wound HydroGel is indicated for management of exudating wounds such as leg ulcers, pressure ulcers, diabetic ulcers, first- and second-degree burns and mechanically or surgically debrided wounds.
                    Product Category: Dressings
                    Sub-category: Hydrogels: Amorphous
                    Product Features:
                    * Usable on infected wounds
                    * Conforms readily to wound
                    * Compatible w/ topicals
                    * Clear
                    Other Features:
                    * Educational Material Available
                    * Free Samples/Trials Available
                    * Published Clinical Article Available
                    HCPCS Code: A6250
                    Company information:
                    Oculus Innovative Sciences, Inc. [1]
                    1129 N. McDowell Blvd.
                    Petaluma, California 94954
                    United States
                    Oculus Innovative Sciences is a commercial healthcare company that designs, produces and markets safe and effective tissue care products based upon the Microcyn® Technology platform, which reduces need for antibiotics while reducing infections and accelerating healing.
                    Website: www.oculusis.com
                    Email: dmcfadden@oculusis.com
                    Phone: 707-283-0550
                    Fax: 707-283-0551
                    Benefits
                    • Protects against dehydration, contamination and absorbs wound exudates
                    • Safe to use around the nose, mouth, and eyes
                    • Maintains a moist wound environment
                    • Encourages autolytic debridement
                    • Contains over 95% water
                    • Non-irritating
                    • Non-sensitizing
                    • Non-toxic
                    • Non-cytotoxic
                    Indications

                    Oculus Microcyn Skin and Wound Gel is intended for over-the counter (OTC) and professional use as follows:
                    OTC: Indicated for use on minor skin abrasions, lacerations, minor irritations and intact skin.
                    Professional Use: Indicated for exuding wounds such as leg ulcers, pressure ulcers, diabetic ulcers, and for the management of mechanically or surgically debrided wounds. Recommended Use: Diabetic Ulcers, Lacerations, Leg Ulcers, Pressure Ulcers, Skin Abrasions, Surgical Wounds
                    [/COLOR]

                    I am wondering if daily cleansing with Hibiclens is a good idea. A solution like Hibiclens may be used for first aid or surgical wound care, but for long term care it may be actually too strong and may delay healing. Some milder alternative cleansing agents may be medicated products such as Provon and Satin Soap, Liquid tea tree oil soap, Almay Clearly Natural, Hypocare, and NutriBiotic. You may want to try trading off cleansing these sores with the medicated products and try mild hydrating cleanser like CeraVe Hydrating Cleanser and following up with CeraVe Hydrating Lotion or Cream. All of these products can be found in drugstores and/or natural food stores.

                    There are a lot of things to try and specialist to consult before taking drastic steps.

                    All the best,
                    GJ

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by william View Post
                      Hi everyone

                      Been awhile since my last post...about six months i guess. In my previous posts i discussed my lower leg sores,from the knee down. I have seen multiple Dermatologists thru the years.Almost six years worth of punch biopisis..scrapes...even removing a section of flesh to analyze.Multiple regiments of antibiotics...creams...lotions.Wrapping legs with soaked gauze bandages with bactraban and eucerin lotion mixture....then wrapped with ace bandage. Tried bee honey from australia...or some place like that.My last dermatologist...6 months ago said he had no doubt my leg wounds were due to my immune system. Was put on Methatrexate and Folic acid.The Folic acid to keep the Methatrexate from damaging my liver.6 months later..and legs still horrible looking, with big sores full of stinking yellow pus.

                      My toenails continue to fall off. When i first tried Microcyn...i had some improvement. Then switched to Vetricyn VF for the double strength.I was amazed how the sores started drying up..and the scabs were just falling off. But i am sad to say that after awhile the Vetericyn VF stopped working. Now leg wounds are once again looking and smelling the same.I use puppy pads under my legs to absorb all the drainage...which at times smells like urine.

                      My aide is washing my legs with Hibiclens...and then VetVF...but nothing changes.After 6 yrs....i'm tired of it all.Right now i'm on the wound-vac system for a pressuse sore on my right hip.I'm under the care of a general surgeon for my wound care. After i'm healed i'm..Seriously....SERIOUSLY...considering above the knee amputation of both legs.Being people that could or might understand how i feel after being frustrated for so long.Would you be willing to give me your most heartfelt opinion. I' a C6 quad since 1994.

                      Thanks
                      A couple of members have had amputations and reported that their lives have improved. Do a search here and check out what they had to say.
                      Don - Grad Student Emeritus
                      T3 ASIA A 26 years post injury

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by paramoto View Post
                        I have read about microcyn gel though the information is not clear and I have not been able to readmthis whole thread. Is anyone cathing with microcyn gel as a lubricant and are they getting any results in the reduction of colonization?

                        Second, as the last poster is doing, would injecting 20ml straight into the bladder from one cath to another work? Would that be the best indication of use? Any possible side effects? Last, where do you buy this.
                        Yes, several members here use the Microcyn/Vetericyn gel as a lubricant on their intermittent catheters. I don't know if there is any evidence that lubrication with Microcyn/Vetericyn gel reduces colonization, but it may very well be a "belts and suspenders" addition to a clean intermittent catheter (CIC) routine.

                        To your second paragraph...let me correct your terminology. We are not "injecting" Microcyn/Vetericyn, we are instilling Microcyn/Vetericyn. Those of us who are using Vetericyn are instilling (introducing Vetericyn into our bladders via a slip tip syringe and retaining the Vetericyn for a period of time and then draining it). There are those of us who can tolerate instilling Vetericyn into our bladders, if we are cathing intermittently, from one cath to the next. There are those of us who can not. You will need to try various techniques to find out what suits you best.

                        Some of us who instill Vetericyn (quantity and amount of time instilled) have experienced diarrhea. That is a downside that you have to experiment with and find out how your body reacts. I know there are several people in our midst who CIC and instill Vetericyn into their bladders from one catheterization to another and have no side effects at all.

                        I strongly urge you to take the time and effort to read and study the various threads about using Vetericyn as a bladder instillation to get a sense about how you may want to use this product.

                        /forum/showthread.php?t=133414
                        /forum/showthread.php?t=149966
                        /forum/showthread.php?t=143797
                        /forum/showthread.php?t=167480

                        http://vetericyn.com/technology/faq.php

                        All the best,
                        GJ
                        Last edited by gjnl; 03-17-2012, 02:06 PM.

                        Comment


                        • I will. Thanks.

                          Originally posted by gjnl View Post
                          Yes, several members here use the Microcyn/Vetericyn gel as a lubricant on their intermittent catheters. I don't know if there is any evidence that lubrication with Microcyn/Vetericyn gel reduces colonization, but it may very well be a "belts and suspenders" addition to an clean intermittent catheter (CIC) routine.

                          To your second paragraph...let me correct your terminology. We are not "injecting" Microcyn/Vetericyn, we are instilling Microcyn/Vetericyn. Those of us who are using Vetericyn are instilling (introducing Vetericyn into our bladders via a slip tip syringe and retaining the Vetericyn for a period of time and then draining it). There are those of us who can tolerate instilling Vetericyn into our bladders, if we are cathing intermittently, from on cath to the next. There are those of us who can not. You will need to try various techniques to find out what suits you best.

                          Some of us who instill Vetericyn (quantity and amount of time instilled) have experienced diarrhea. That is a downside that you have to experiment with and find out how your body reacts. I know there are several people in our midst who CIC and instill Vetericyn into their bladders from one catheterization to another and have no side effects at all.

                          I strongly urge you to take the time and effort to read and study the various threads about using Vetericyn as a bladder instillation to get a sense about how you may want to use this product.

                          /forum/showthread.php?t=133414
                          /forum/showthread.php?t=149966
                          /forum/showthread.php?t=143797
                          /forum/showthread.php?t=167480

                          http://vetericyn.com/technology/faq.php

                          All the best,
                          GJ
                          T6 complete (or so I think), SCI since September 21, 2003

                          Comment


                          • Amputation

                            Hello all

                            Thanks Gini, Donno for your response. Gini, i have been a Type 2 diabetic for 8 years.My first Dermatologist ruled out diabetic ulcers.I have good blood circulation in my lower legs. Had the ultrasound test done on my legs....i believe that's what it's called. Tried the Vetericyn Hydrogel.No marked improvement to legs.Have never seen a Infectious Disease Specialist.Not sure if covered by medicare.Do appreciate all comments.SCI Nurse...may i ask your opinion concerning above the knee amputation of both legs. The sores stop at the top of knees...and are only on top of legs...no sores underneath legs.

                            Thank you all

                            william
                            william

                            Comment


                            • Just wanted to mention real quick that the company had helped me with my earlier stated problem of getting this "miracle water" in Germany. Oculus is a great company, and their products, especially the Vetericyn VF, are great. I wish I could help to get it to all people in Europe who are in need of it. My bone-deep pressure wound has just closed today. We used Vetericyn VF plus iodine salve and cotton for 4 1/2 months. And I am free of antibiotics for my bladder ever since I use it. Feels great!!!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Regine View Post
                                Just wanted to mention real quick that the company had helped me with my earlier stated problem of getting this "miracle water" in Germany. Oculus is a great company, and their products, especially the Vetericyn VF, are great. I wish I could help to get it to all people in Europe who are in need of it. My bone-deep pressure wound has just closed today. We used Vetericyn VF plus iodine salve and cotton for 4 1/2 months. And I am free of antibiotics for my bladder ever since I use it. Feels great!!!
                                So good to hear from you again, and to find out you have a local supplier of Vetericyn. Even better news that your wound has healed and that Vetericyn use with your bladder is rendering you antibiotic and better still infection free.

                                All the best,
                                GJ

                                Comment

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