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Microcyn Bladder Treatment (An Open Letter to Dr. Young)

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    Originally posted by Leila View Post
    As far as parasites go, yes I would agree that microorganisms are not technically defined as parasites. But, under certain conditions they are most certainly parasitic. When they infect the human body, this is how they affect our system. I am using the term broadly here, as an adjective not a noun. You have to be more circumspect to get my drift.
    I knew that's what you meant Leila, don't take it seriously.

    Originally posted by Leila View Post
    I deal with "anecdotal" later. I don't have time for this.
    I hope you don't think the term was used in a derogative way, it's just the way we call it in medicine when we still don't have more evidence to confirm it, it doesn't mean it's not real.

    I, for one, am very happy you brought this topic back (Microcyn) when I had forgotten about it after being interested in it a few years back.
    Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

    Comment


      just wanted to say that i mean no disrespect. just want full clarity. i get what you mean leila, but some may not when it comes to saying well bacteria are parasites. i definitely know you have done ur homework.

      and there is nothing wrong with being a salesman, you are a salesman for your own personal truth, we each are! and that is a wonderful thing as without passion, sometimes things cant move forward. i'm also passionate about bacteria. i highly respect them, even when they make me ill from infection. they are so awesome for being so small.

      i'm hopeful that this will work for me. maybe, i know it is superficial, i can get rid of what is called ridging in my nails from constant infection lol or even just reduce my times in the hospital for infection, that'd be cool.

      jgni is correct about anecdotal evidence. it isnt derogatory, just a statement of fact. nothing more. we just want outside confirmation with numbers to support what the website claims. tis normal.

      i hope things are getting better with your son? and that you are getting help emotionally for this tough time.
      "Smells like death in a bucket of chicken!"
      http://www.elportavoz.com/

      Comment


        Anecdotal is not a judgment about the veracity of anyone's experience -- it's the proper terminology for evidence based on casual observations or personal experiences rather than scientific analysis.

        What we've heard from the five members who've used the product is all anecdotal evidence. It may prove to be statistically accurate and repeatable across large groups of users, but there's not yet been clinical trials to demonstrate that.
        It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.

        ~Julius Caesar

        Comment


          Originally posted by JGNI View Post
          I have to agree with you here, even though it can be possible that some are susceptible to get diarrhea when using it, I am not convinced at all that said diarrhea is caused by interference with the microflora of the intestinal tract. It could be a totally different mechanism or just anecdotal and not related to Vetericyn use.

          As for bacteria being parasites, cryptic is right, not the case, moreover, we could not live without them (much more on us than human cells), they just get where they don't belong sometimes and wreck havoc.

          Good luck to all of us in our early experimentations, I for one will only use it when needed for now and do an in/out 60 ml flush. I may use it in prophylaxis in the future, something like once a week.
          Think what you will brother, but I've been at this 25 years, had literally hundreds of urine infections, and been treated with dozens of antibiotics hundreds of times. Uroseptic many times, C-diff many times. Unfortunately this area I'm a near professional. Not being smart, but th vetericyn will cause diarrhea if in bladder prolonged period. I used it 4 straight days for 60 minutes. Learned my lesson, but still glad I found this thread.

          Comment


            Originally posted by shamrock88 View Post
            I've been at this 25 years, had literally hundreds of urine infections, and been treated with dozens of antibiotics hundreds of times. Uroseptic many times, C-diff many times. Unfortunately this area I'm a near professional.
            Unfortunately, you are not the only pro here in that area (27 years here). On another note, I think you read my post the wrong way.
            Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

            Comment


              Originally posted by shamrock88 View Post
              Think what you will brother, but I've been at this 25 years, had literally hundreds of urine infections, and been treated with dozens of antibiotics hundreds of times. Uroseptic many times, C-diff many times. Unfortunately this area I'm a near professional. Not being smart, but th vetericyn will cause diarrhea if in bladder prolonged period. I used it 4 straight days for 60 minutes. Learned my lesson, but still glad I found this thread.
              actually... ppl's bladders sit in front of the large intestine, so something can transverse the bladder and gi tract walls. it is physically possible if the microcyn has some mechanism that can get through a bacterium wall, regular cells of the bladder/gi tract arent as sophisticated as the cell wall of bacteria (particularly the gram negatives)
              "Smells like death in a bucket of chicken!"
              http://www.elportavoz.com/

              Comment


                JenJen, have you ever had any experience with either your daily use or the bladder flushes triggering yeast infections?
                It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.

                ~Julius Caesar

                Comment


                  Originally posted by JGNI View Post
                  Unfortunately, you are not the only pro here in that area (27 years here). On another note, I think you read my post the wrong way.

                  dam, professional was meant tongue in cheek, thought that was obvious. Have you used the product yet,or communicated with Dr. Bongiovanni? use it for 60 minutes + 4 straight days let me know how it goes.
                  Good luck.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by shamrock88 View Post
                    dam, professional was meant tongue in cheek, thought that was obvious. Have you used the product yet,or communicated with Dr. Bongiovanni? use it for 60 minutes + 4 straight days let me know how it goes.
                    Good luck.
                    I thought it was obvious I was using it "tongue in cheek" too, did you think I meant pro in any other manner ? I just went through a lot too in those 27 years ...

                    I don't have UTI's since I am on an antibiotic prophylaxis for now but I have Vetericyn on hand for when it will happen and I will not hesitate to use it although, as I mentioned earlier, it will be only for in/out 30 sec flushes twice a day when I will need it (no way I am keeping it 60 mins and get diarrhea ... )
                    Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

                    Comment


                      I don't think there's any doubt that if you leave the microcyn in there too long it's going to diffuse into the intestines. JenJen and Shamrock's experience is valid. It's just that it doesn't happen quickly. I think what JenJen meant was not that she puts it in her bladder and "in a heartbeat" she's got diarrhea. She probably used the phrase "in a heartbeat" in an emotive way, not literally. Something like, if I leave it in my bladder too long, then BAM, all of a sudden the symptoms hit me. I don't think she meant us to take "in a heartbeat" literally. I just misunderstood her, that's all. That's language for you--it's not always so precise.

                      Let's not get too adverserial here. This thread is being read and watched by those outside the SCI community. There are those interested in the outcome of your experiments with the microcyn bladder treatment. Let's just be forgiving of any misunderstandings and let the experiment go forward. It's bigger than all of us and has a life of it's own. We're here to serve it as best we can.

                      Thanks for your words of support CrypticGimp and JGNI. That made me feel better. My son is having a pretty rough time, but I've got John, well and strong, not incapacitated by the infections and antibiotics, before we found out about microcyn.

                      Much Love,

                      Leila
                      I'm back on Facebook again--up and running!

                      http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?...00000532232573

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by loreo View Post
                        Reporting back to the troops:
                        I got my hands on some Vetericyn. My parents brought 3 bottles across the border on their way back from Florida with no hassle. Each bottle was $44 for 16 oz. I'm going to try and find it cheaper but I didn't want to send them on a hunting expedition. It was still cheaper than having it delivered up here.

                        I did my first flush Sunday afternoon with 60 cc. I left it in for 10 minutes while I rolled around trying to make sure it got into every nook and cranny. There was immediate results in clarity and reduced sediment. Second flush was Monday morning with less than 60 cc (probably closer to 40 - I'm trying to use it sparingly cuz it's so expensive). Pretty much all signs of infection had disappeared except the urine still has a slight infected scent. I did a third flush Monday night with 60 cc. I left it in for about half an hour while I got ready to go to bed.

                        So now my urine is crystal clear, mitro-related mucus is down to almost none, but my urine still has a slight infected scent. So, I'm not sure if the infection is completely gone. Any insights from our experienced users?

                        I'm using the spray before each cath as a preventative measure. I may do a once-a-week flush for maintenance.

                        So far I'm very impressed with the results.
                        oh loreo I forgot tha you had a mitro, please let me know if you have any adverse effects as I wont get my order until probably early next week. of course I have such darn sensitive skin, when I used some of the anasept gel I mentioned earlier around my stoma opening the skin seemed to swell a little and it took slightly more effort to insert the cath. I plan to test the vetericyn there first.
                        Embrace uncertainty. Hard problems rarely have easy solutions. Jonah Lehrer

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by JGNI View Post
                          I thought it was obvious I was using it "tongue in cheek" too, did you think I meant pro in any other manner ? I just went through a lot too in those 27 years ...

                          I don't have UTI's since I am on an antibiotic prophylaxis for now but I have Vetericyn on hand for when it will happen and I will not hesitate to use it although, as I mentioned earlier, it will be only for in/out 30 sec flushes twice a day when I will need it (no way I am keeping it 60 mins and get diarrhea ... )
                          It's all good brother, your doing something right if your having no uti problems in 27 years. That prophylactic system just got me Super resistant bugs, I suppose everyone is different. Back in the Day, urologist used to rotate me monthly with 4 different antibiotics. That strategy obviously frowned upon now. Again, good luck, Canadians/Bruins??

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by shamrock88 View Post
                            It's all good brother, your doing something right if your having no uti problems in 27 years. That prophylactic system just got me Super resistant bugs, I suppose everyone is different. Back in the Day, urologist used to rotate me monthly with 4 different antibiotics. That strategy obviously frowned upon now. Again, good luck, Canadians/Bruins??
                            The Canadiens will have to work hard, just lost tonight but we all hope to go against the Bruins and boo Chara every time he touches the puck

                            No, I am very prone to UTI's and have been quite sick too. On a prophylaxis since February because I was sick too often. I am sure I would get sick quite fast if I was to stop. Anyway, I know another UTI will eventually come so my results will appear here after.

                            Keep us updated on your situation!
                            Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

                            Comment


                              If I hold my penis to where the hole is open and spray Microcyn there, you think it would matter much? I'm assuming I gave myself an E. coli infection doing my bowel program, so the tissues are obviously sensitive to traveling substances.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by crypticgimp View Post
                                jgni is correct about anecdotal evidence. it isnt derogatory, just a statement of fact. nothing more. we just want outside confirmation with numbers to support what the website claims. tis normal.
                                Originally posted by thehipcrip View Post
                                Anecdotal is not a judgment about the veracity of anyone's experience -- it's the proper terminology for evidence based on casual observations or personal experiences rather than scientific analysis.
                                Science chicks! ( swoon)

                                Comment

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